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Old 01-26-2013, 06:40 AM   #11
Peter Knutsen
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Default Re: Cosmic on Beneficial Afflictions to Allow Waiving Resistance?

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Originally Posted by Refplace View Post
Unless your casting it on really unhealthy people your likely to succeed anyhow.
No. An average target has HT 10 and will thus only succeed half the time.

+50% Cosmic does sound reasonable, though.
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Old 01-26-2013, 09:56 AM   #12
munin
 
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Default Re: Cosmic on Beneficial Afflictions to Allow Waiving Resistance?

The problem with using Cosmic, +50% to waive a beneficial activation roll (what we might as well call a reversed resistance roll) is that you're also getting one of the biggest parts of Malediction: ignoring DR (if they don't have to roll, they don't have to worry about their DR making the roll harder). Thus, you're asking for most of the benefits of Malediction 1 (waive activation roll, ignore DR) with few of the drawbacks (Short Range penalties, can't add other penetration modifiers) and saying it's worth less.

Thus, I think this is in the Cosmic, No die roll required, +100% territory (the usual enhancement to ignore an activation roll). With that enhancement, if their HT - 1 + AfflictionLevel - DR* is 3 or greater, they don't have to roll. It costs the same as Malediction 1, but it retains the 2/3/5 range penalties of an unmodified attack.


* A strict reading of the Beneficial Afflictions rule (p. P40) would imply that DR would make the roll easier, which doesn't make sense to me so I've ignored it.
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Old 01-26-2013, 10:06 AM   #13
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Default Re: Cosmic on Beneficial Afflictions to Allow Waiving Resistance?

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Originally Posted by munin View Post
The problem with using Cosmic, +50% to waive a beneficial activation roll (what we might as well call a reversed resistance roll) is that you're also getting one of the biggest parts of Malediction: ignoring DR (if they don't have to roll, they don't have to worry about their DR making the roll harder). Thus, you're asking for most of the benefits of Malediction 1 (waive activation roll, ignore DR) with few of the drawbacks (Short Range penalties, can't add other penetration modifiers) and saying it's worth less.

Thus, I think this is in the Cosmic, No die roll required, +100% territory (the usual enhancement to ignore an activation roll). With that enhancement, if their HT - 1 + AfflictionLevel - DR* is 3 or greater, they don't have to roll. It costs the same as Malediction 1, but it retains the 2/3/5 range penalties of an unmodified attack.

* A strict reading of the Beneficial Afflictions rule (p. P40) would imply that DR would make the roll easier, which doesn't make sense to me so I've ignored it.
I don't know...maledictions also have other effects like affecting insubstantial targets. Also, how is ignoring DR on a friendly target an issue? They can take armor off, or you make a targeted attack to the face (unarmored) which they don't dodge...I fail to see how it's relevant.
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Old 01-26-2013, 10:46 AM   #14
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Default Re: Cosmic on Beneficial Afflictions to Allow Waiving Resistance?

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Also, how is ignoring DR on a friendly target an issue? They can take armor off,
In the middle of combat, yeah.
[quote]or you make a targeted attack to the face (unarmored) which they don't dodge...[quote]And you miss since Telegraphic isn't allowed on ranged attacks. Or they have natural DR over all body. Or even Force Field.
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I fail to see how it's relevant.
I fail to see how it's not obvious.
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Old 01-26-2013, 11:11 AM   #15
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Default Re: Cosmic on Beneficial Afflictions to Allow Waiving Resistance?

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In the middle of combat, yeah.
And you miss since Telegraphic isn't allowed on ranged attacks. Or they have natural DR over all body. Or even Force Field.
I fail to see how it's not obvious.
Yeah, like I meant taking off armor in combat...

My bad on using the term "targeted attack" the manoeuvre...simply aim at their face and they just don't defend. Unless you're trying to say you can't aim a ranged attack, which makes the Acc kind of pointless.

Ultimately, giving up on the nit-picking, I fail to see how allowing a friendly target to waive their resistance on a beneficial affliction (as an attack) is EQUAL to maledictions, which allow the armor ignore, auto failing of resistance, affecting insubstantial allies, removes active defenses in lieu of a resistance roll, changing from an attack (DX-based) to a spell (Will-based), and more...

Malediction fundamentally alters the affliction from an attack into a spell - thats why the DR is ignored, and also why restance can be waived - who would resist Haste for example? I just don't see how allowing an (attack) affliction that is already limited (i.e. beneficial instead of harming) to let an ally (only) voluntarily waive defense is more than +50%?
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Old 01-26-2013, 11:17 AM   #16
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Default Re: Cosmic on Beneficial Afflictions to Allow Waiving Resistance?

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Malediction fundamentally alters the affliction from an attack into a spell - thats why the DR is ignored, and also why restance can be waived - who would resist Haste for example? I just don't see how allowing an (attack) affliction that is already limited (i.e. beneficial instead of harming) to let an ally (only) voluntarily waive defense is more than +50%?
Remember malediction also comes with limitations like the reduced range.
However you have several posts that agree with the +50% is enough so arguing against the cost of malediction at +100% seems kind of pointless.
Also there are a few who told you they houserule you can just waive at no cost.
If your game then use that, if your looking for RAW then Cosmic is the way to override a rule and you have support or agreement from several that it seems fine in this case.
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Old 01-27-2013, 03:54 PM   #17
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Default Re: Cosmic on Beneficial Afflictions to Allow Waiving Resistance?

Thanks! There seems to be enough support that I think allowing this Cosmic will be fine.
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Old 01-27-2013, 04:10 PM   #18
David Johnston2
 
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Default Re: Cosmic on Beneficial Afflictions to Allow Waiving Resistance?

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I don't know...maledictions also have other effects like affecting insubstantial targets.
I don't think I'd count an affliction as a physical or energy attack.
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Old 01-27-2013, 04:34 PM   #19
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Default Re: Cosmic on Beneficial Afflictions to Allow Waiving Resistance?

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I don't think I'd count an affliction as a physical or energy attack.
It depends. Certainly if it's a Malediction it's not really physical anymore. But standard Affliction is classified in GURPS as a "Physical" trait, and it is the trait for building certain kinds of mundane physical attacks like poisonous (non-damaging) attacks that animals might have.
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