Multiplicative Disadvantages?

[Mailanka]

Originally Posted by Mark Skarr

Playing mostly Supers games, I understand where Kirbwarrior is coming from, but I don’t see a need for it. I used to, and had been trying to figure this out, myself, until I had an epiphany: Playing supers, disadvantages, really, are there for character refinement or the inclusion of a weakness. They’re not there to provide much in the way of spare points. So, I increased the point total from 500 to 750 and capped disadvantages at -75.

The result was immediate: better thought out characters that could do what the players wanted without having crippling disadvantages. Or, as I said to them “characters, not caricatures.” When they stopped looking at disadvantages for “points” and more for “character definition” the character building sessions took a turn for the better.

I agree, with the caveat that sometimes, a huge amount of disadvantages is totally in character for something like the "cursed hero" or what have you. Your core point stands, though: Give them enough points to make the character they want, and the disadvantages become more about flavor, a bonus, than about eeking out a few extra points.

(Example: A ninja in my Chambara game has more than -100 in disads. His master was murdered, and the assassins pinned the blame on him. Now he works for a daimyo as his secret agent, pretending to be a scandalously rude yojimbo by day, and playing the role of terrifying assassin by night. He has an entire ninja clan as an enemy [-40], his extremely hazardous duty to his Clan [-20], and his secret identity [-20], and his -2 status for being a bum/ninja [-10], and that's -90 before we even get into the personality defining disadvantages. He's about the only non-female character (who tend to be saddled with "You're a woman in feudal japan" problems) with so many disadvantage points, but they can happen. I built that character myself, and I wasn't hunting for more points, those were appropriate for the character I was building.)

[David Johnston2]

The higher the point total of the character, the more limitations on advantages become the important thing and the less disadvantages matter. I don't even bother putting disad limits on super characters who are 1000+ They only encourage people to push whatever limit is set.

[Mark Skarr]

Originally Posted by Mailanka

I agree, with the caveat that sometimes, a huge amount of disadvantages is totally in character for something like the "cursed hero" or what have you. Your core point stands, though: Give them enough points to make the character they want, and the disadvantages become more about flavor, a bonus, than about eeking out a few extra points.

Well, yes. There are always characters who are cursed/screwed and they get a lot more disads than anyone else. But, those tend to be special case/my characters, and not normal.

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

The higher the point total of the character, the more limitations on advantages become the important thing and the less disadvantages matter. I don't even bother putting disad limits on super characters who are 1000+ They only encourage people to push whatever limit is set.

I agree that the limitations are more valuable than disads at high point levels. I also like Multiplicitive Modifiers because it prevents people from making crippled powers, setting a functional cap of -80%. It can have more, but you don't get to count them.

I've had a few players, over the years, that would try to get as many points from disads as they could, which is why I use a limit. It tells everyone how messed up I want characters. But, all my players know that if they want something special, I'll consider it in relation to the rest of the game.

[Not another shrubbery]

Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire

Most disadvantages don't take percentile modifiers, and multiplicative modifiers only affects percentile modifiers; those that do take percentile modifiers take limitations which reduce the point value and operate as if under additive modifiers (as you really need both positive and negative percentiles for multiplicative modifiers to do anything).

"Don't have any noted in the rules" might be a better way of putting it. It's easy for me to imagine enhancements and limitations for Disadvantages in a general way*, it's just that the list from Basic is fairly comprehensive, and I have found that simple extrapolation or comparison gives me adequate results when I need a new one or a version of an existing one. I imagine that's the way many other GMs work, as well.

*See Dependency. It has the special Enhancement, Aging.