Trying to codify Political Rank

[awesomenessofme1]

Political Rank does exist canonically, though not in the Basic Set. It was first mentioned in Social Engineering and was expanded upon in Pulling Rank. So, based on the small amount that's out there, here's the way I see it (this is for the US):

PR7: President (this is the only one that's been confirmed)
PR6: Vice President, Senator, Speaker of the House, major cabinet secretary
PR5: Representative, governor, minor cabinet secretary
PR4: Major city mayor, lower-level statewide office
PR3: State Senator, minor city mayor
PR2: State Representative, small town mayor
PR1: City council member

Thoughts? Is there any you think I should move around? Any suggestions for where other offices might fit in?

[Black Leviathan]

I feel like Political influence would be better represented by Status as it is more the power to influence events than to control them. With the exception of the president who legitimately has military rank all of the others have power because of their ability to make things difficult for people who are less powerful.

[David Johnston2]

I'm not sure I believe in "political" rank. The president doesn't actually have authority to give, say, a mayor or a legislator orders. He does have temporary rank over things like the military and the civil services but if he wants cooperation against other elected officials he has to use connections persuading and horse trading assisted by the fact that he's always dealing with lower status people than him. And the vice president doesn't have authority over anyone except his personal staff.

[Phantasm]

This is where a Political Empowerment advantage similar to Legal Enforcement Powers and Clerical Investment may come in handy.

If dead set on using Rank, I'd consider the Pulling Rank variant for the Assistance Roll for the aid available from the granting agency.

Modern politics is a pain when it comes to simplifying for GURPS, since politics is never simple.

[awesomenessofme1]

Worth noting that I'm not really talking about the implementation of Rank within a game, but just the rankings. And as I said in the first post, Political Rank is actually an advantage that exists canonically

[Donny Brook]

Originally Posted by awesomenessofme1

Political Rank does exist canonically, though not in the Basic Set. It was first mentioned in Social Engineering and was expanded upon in Pulling Rank. So, based on the small amount that's out there, here's the way I see it (this is for the US):

PR7: President (this is the only one that's been confirmed)
PR6: Vice President, Senator, Speaker of the House, major cabinet secretary
PR5: Representative, governor, minor cabinet secretary
PR4: Major city mayor, lower-level statewide office
PR3: State Senator, minor city mayor
PR2: State Representative, small town mayor
PR1: City council member

Thoughts? Is there any you think I should move around? Any suggestions for where other offices might fit in?

That structure does not align with the general concept of rank heirarchy in real life, nor the way it is implemented in Basic Set, which (quite appropriately) says: "Each Rank has authority over those of lower Rank".

The presidency does not have heirarchical authority over the roles below it on your list. Senators do not have authority over Representatives. Etc.

I think the concept of political rank is probably fundamentally flawed. Some of those roles have Administrative rank in a bureaucracy, and the president has (top) military rank.

[awesomenessofme1]

Originally Posted by Donny Brook

That structure does not align with the general concept of rank heirarchy in real life, nor the way it is implemented in Basic Set, which (quite appropriately) says: "Each Rank has authority over those of lower Rank".

The presidency does not have heirarchical authority over the roles below it on your list. Senators do not have authority over Representatives. Etc.

I think the concept of political rank is probably fundamentally flawed. Some of those roles have Administrative rank in a bureaucracy, and the president has (top) military rank.

OK, but Political Rank is explicitly referred to as existing in Social Engineering and SE: Pulling Rank, as well as several Pyramid articles. In Pulling Rank, it's described thusly: "Administrative Rank for representatives, senators, etc. whose nominal organization is the state itself, not some specific branch." and the President is explicitly described as Political Rank 7. To me it sounds like Political Rank is a bit of an edge case where there clearly are levels of power, but it doesn't fit directly into a hierarchy.

[Donny Brook]

Originally Posted by awesomenessofme1

OK, but Political Rank is explicitly referred to as existing in Social Engineering and SE: Pulling Rank, as well as several Pyramid articles. In Pulling Rank, it's described thusly: "Administrative Rank for representatives, senators, etc. whose nominal organization is the state itself, not some specific branch." and the President is explicitly described as Political Rank 7. To me it sounds like Political Rank is a bit of an edge case where there clearly are levels of power, but it doesn't fit directly into a hierarchy.

Remember, the Church decreed the sun revolved around the Earth.

The most important rule in all the books is on page B492:
"When any rule gives a silly result, follow common sense instead. No matter how much we playtest, no rules are perfect – including these."

[awesomenessofme1]

Originally Posted by Donny Brook

Remember, the Church decreed the sun revolved around the Earth.

The most important rule in all the books is on page B492:
"When any rule gives a silly result, follow common sense instead. No matter how much we playtest, no rules are perfect – including these."

Sure, but Political Rank as described is still a formal position at a certain level within an organization that grants authority and power. The only difference is the hierarchy, which is a significant one, but not a deal-breaker in my opinion.

[Donny Brook]

Originally Posted by awesomenessofme1

Sure, but Political Rank as described is still a formal position at a certain level within an organization that grants authority and power. The only difference is the hierarchy, which is a significant one, but not a deal-breaker in my opinion.

Definitely run with it if you can figure out a way that actually makes it work to your satisfaction.