08252019, 07:26 PM  #21 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA

Re: Conditional Injury with Knowing Your Own Strength
You'll need to remake the tables based on 20xlog10 instead of 30xlog10 (easy with a spreadsheet, otherwise requires you to remember values). Also need to redo the addition and subtraction table and wound thresholds.

08252019, 08:45 PM  #22 
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southeast NC

Re: Conditional Injury with Knowing Your Own Strength
Regarding armor, my thoughts were along these lines. Given that +1 Wound Potential is about +50% damage, that means that armor stops all of WP X allows through about 1/3 of X+1, 1/2 of X+2, 2/3 of X+3, and 4/5 of X+4. On this scale:
1/3 = 3 1/2 = 2 1/3 = 1 4/5 is between 1 and 0. As long as you're consistent, you could round it up or down. Regarding +3 ST = +1 WP, I assumed damage scaled with the square root of BL (roughly the same as RAW, but I did some figuring involving force, mass, and distance over which acceleration occurs to make sure the number wasn't unreasonable). On a logarithmic scale, taking a root becomes dividing, so the square root of damage means half the WP. +3 ST = ×2 BL, therefore +3 ST = ×1.5 damage = +1 WP. Edit: I don't have access to the original KYOS right now. It occurs to me that I may have made modifications to it.
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08262019, 01:42 AM  #23 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: the frozen wastelands of Southern California

Re: Conditional Injury with Knowing Your Own Strength
Here's an alternative to the Robustness Threshold and Wound Potential Tables that's based on +20=×10 instead of the current +6=×10:
HP/dmg: RT/WP  1: 0 2: 6 3: 9 4: 12 5: 14 6: 16 7: 17 8: 18 9: 19 10: 20 11: 21 –13: 22 –15: 23 –17: 24 –19: 25 –21: 26 –24: 27 –27: 28 –30: 29 –34: 30 –38: 31 –42: 32 –47: 33 –53: 34 –59: 35 –65: 36 –75: 37 –85: 38 –95: 39 –105: 40 –115: 41 –135: 42 –150: 43 –170: 44 –190: 45 –210: 46 –240: 47 –270: 48 –300: 49 –340: 50 –380: 51 –420: 52 –470: 53 –530: 54 –590: 55 –650: 56 –750: 57 –850: 58 –950: 59 Entries starting with a – are ranges that start one higher than the previous entry: so “–13” is actually “12–13”, and “–950” is actually “851–950”. You can extend this table further by multiplying HP/dmg by 10 and adding 20 to RT/WP. The rule for applying DR (actually, logsubtraction) is: WP vs. LogDR: WP modifier 0 or less: no damage +1: 21 +2: 13 +3: 10 +4: 8 +5: 7 +6: 6 +7: 5 +8: 4 +9–+10: 3 +11–+13: 2 +14–+19: 1 +20 or more: 0 That is, find out how much the WP exceeds the “LogDR”, and reduce the effective WP by an amount based on the difference. LogDR comes from DR the same way that RT comes from HP. Damage ranges (e.g., 1d, 2d, 2d×10, etc.) have a 16point spread: 1d goes from WP0 to WP16; 2d goes from WP6 to WP22; 3d6 goes from WP9 to WP25; 4d goes from WP12 to WP27; 5d goes from WP14 to WP29; 6d goes from WP16 to WP31; 7d goes from WP17 to WP32; 8d goes from WP18 to WP34; and so on. That is, the maximum WP you can achieve is 15 higher than the minimum you can achieve. Meanwhile, the average damage you can roll always translates to a WP that's 11 higher than the minimum, and 4 less than the maximum. You can get a reasonable approximation of this by rolling 5d, adding the top three dice to the average WP of the attack, and subtracting 14 from the result. That's your damage roll. Last edited by dataweaver; 08262019 at 02:04 AM. 
08262019, 01:38 PM  #24  
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Columbus, Ohio

Re: Conditional Injury with Knowing Your Own Strength
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Actually, it seems like my guess is correct. HP 34 is RT 30, and [20 × log(34)] is ~30. Just in case I found a oneoff coincidence, I checked with other values. HP 190 is RT 45, and [20 × log(190)] is ~45. I don't understand what I did, but I did it. So, it almost seems like, if you converted HP with the KYOS ST formula, then ~RT would just be HP + 10. Then, at that point, couldn't you just knock the +10 off of each side? Unless I'm just making stuff up, which is very possible. Also, would it be beneficial to also switch the Conditional Effects Table over to ×10 = +20? Or does it really matter?
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08262019, 02:31 PM  #25  
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA

Re: Conditional Injury with Knowing Your Own Strength
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08262019, 02:32 PM  #26 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: the frozen wastelands of Southern California

Re: Conditional Injury with Knowing Your Own Strength
I'm operating on the premise that HP increase roughly at the same rate as damage, on the notion that maintaining a parity between damage and HP will avoid obvious problems of disparities between what you can dish out and what you can take. Thing is, I'm not assuming that damage increases linearly with ST; that's kind of the whole point of Conditional Injury, to put damage and HP on a geometric progression with respect to ST.
Remember that weight is also being recalibrated (by KYOS) to be on an exponential scale; so the relationship between weight and HP is still something to the effect of HP=weight^n; I'm just not sure off the top of my head what n is. I think it's ˝. On the other hand, I'm trying to keep RT, WP, and the equivalent counterpart to DR directly proportional to ST; and as much as possible, I'm trying to get all of the mechanics to work with them instead of dmg, HP, and DR: if I can do that, then I can render moot the HPtoRT and dmgtoWP tables, except for the purpose of converting existing material to RT and WP. Which reminds me: another table that needs to be changed is the Conditional Effect Table. The Severity column needs to be rescaled so that what's currently 6 becomes 20, and what's currently +6 becomes +20. That's a simple multiple, though: just divide by 3 and multiply by 10. So ±6 becomes ±20, ±5 becomes ±16, ±4 becomes ±13, ±3 becomes ±10, ±2 becomes ±6, and ±1 becomes ±3. Likewise, all of the Injury and Severity modifiers need to be inflated to for the new scale: e.g., the Target Composition modifiers for Unloving go from 2, 3, and 4 to 6, 10, and 13. Heck, all modifiers need to be recalibrated to the 20step scale. 
08262019, 03:19 PM  #27 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA

Re: Conditional Injury with Knowing Your Own Strength
The advantages of +30/x10:
The thing this is leaving out is mostly wound width: the 1,000x mass collision might make hole of the same depth as the 10x speed collision, but the hole is much wider. The only attacks in G4e that have a concept of wound with are piercing attacks, but it actually applies to everything. In the case of STbased attacks, a 1,000x more massive creature might not apply 1,000 the force  but it probably applies 100x the force over 10x the distance, for a net of x1,000 energy. 
08262019, 04:02 PM  #28 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: the frozen wastelands of Southern California

Re: Conditional Injury with Knowing Your Own Strength
Personally, Is be more inclined to rework KYOS to use +12=×10, then rework CI to +24=×10. Using a multiple of six gives you easy squares and cubes.

08262019, 05:29 PM  #29  
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA

Re: Conditional Injury with Knowing Your Own Strength
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If I were making bigger changes, I'd probably switch the range/speed chart to decibel (+10=x10) or 2dB (+5 = x10) rather than changing KYoS away from dB, as converting to dB is generally easier than the RSM  for example, 1 AU = 1.6e+11 yards, which can be converted to dB by looking up 1.6 and adding 11x10 (112 dB relative to 1 yard). On the RSM, you instead look up 1.6 and add 11x6 (+67 relative to one yard, +65 relative to 2 yards). 

08262019, 05:55 PM  #30  
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: the frozen wastelands of Southern California

Re: Conditional Injury with Knowing Your Own Strength
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And when you're working in an environment where squares and cubes are likely to come up frequently, the fact that squaring a twelvestep pattern gives you a sixstep pattern, and coming it gives you a fourstep pattern, is much nicer than how the decibel scale behaves in similar conditions. 

Tags 
conditional injury, hit points, knowing your own strength, kyos, logarithm 
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