Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > Dungeon Fantasy Roleplaying Game

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-27-2018, 07:28 PM   #1
Juliansl
 
Juliansl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Default Can you use weapon master for Flame Jet/Innate Attack(Beam)?

I'm considering building a Half-Elf Swashbuckler who can cast Flame Jet, and I'm wondering whether either Flame Jet or Innate Attack(Beam) would be legal targets for Weapon Master.
Juliansl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2018, 08:28 PM   #2
roguebfl
Dog of Lysdexics
 
roguebfl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Melbourne FL, Formerly Wellington NZ
Default Re: Can you use weapon master for Flame Jet/Innate Attack(Beam)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Juliansl View Post
I'm considering building a Half-Elf Swashbuckler who can cast Flame Jet, and I'm wondering whether either Flame Jet or Innate Attack(Beam) would be legal targets for Weapon Master.
Weapon Master normally only apples to Strength Based weapons and Flame Jet isn't; you would need to make a special ruling that the option special case for Force Swords apply to Flame jet
__________________
Rogue the Bronze Firelizard
Gerald Grenier, Jr. Hail Eris!
Rogue's Weyr
roguebfl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2018, 09:07 PM   #3
Juliansl
 
Juliansl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Default Re: Can you use weapon master for Flame Jet/Innate Attack(Beam)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by roguebfl View Post
Weapon Master normally only apples to Strength Based weapons ...[/I]
Can you point me to where it says that? My GM is very strict about RAW.
Juliansl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2018, 11:28 PM   #4
evileeyore
Banned
 
evileeyore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: 100 hurricane swamp
Default Re: Can you use weapon master for Flame Jet/Innate Attack(Beam)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Juliansl View Post
Can you point me to where it says that? My GM is very strict about RAW.
He means "muscle powered weapons" and it's literally the first sentence of the Advantage in regular GURPS.

In DFRPG you are limited to the classes of weapons in the book. The Jet spells do not fall into any of them.


However, your GM is free to decide that particular groups (races, template combinations. etc) might have access to 'weapon' groupings that aren't listed and decide that spell 'weapons' are in those.

Personally.... I'd be open to allowing the Jet spells to count as weapons for the purposes of inclusion into a weapon class (since they do count as melee weapons). However it would be a new weapon class and I'd probably price it at the 'one weapon' level, and it would only work with Jet spells.
evileeyore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2018, 07:45 AM   #5
Kromm
GURPS Line Editor
 
Kromm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Montréal, Québec
Default Re: Can you use weapon master for Flame Jet/Innate Attack(Beam)?

I'd allow it, too, treating Weapon Master (Jets) much like Weapon Master (Bow) or Weapon Master (Knives). The governing skill would be Innate Attack (Beam), not any specific spell.

Be aware that jet spells won't get as many benefits! They'll get damage bonuses and lower Rapid Strike penalties, but that's about it. The halved penalty for multiple parries is nice in theory, but as jets can only parry the same kind of jet, it's only going to apply in the hyper-rare situation where you're facing lots of jet attacks of exactly the same kind as yours. The improved default is completely meaningless for one skill, unless for some bizarre reason you're using Innate Attack at default (which means you'll lose the damage bonus . . .). And the ability to see benefits with melee and thrown uses of a weapon is pointless, because jets are always effectively melee weapons.

So you'd be paying 20 points mostly for the damage bonus, at which point you'd have to ask whether 20 points in your favorite jet spell, for +5 to skill, wouldn't be a better investment. That would let you maintain +1d of damage more than usual, thanks to the cost reduction for high skill, which is likely more useful than a +1 or +2 per die damage bonus on dice you have to pay FP for; it would also let you have +1 yard of reach. For instance, skill 15 with WM and enough skill to get +2 per die would let you maintain 1d+2 for free at reach 1 or 2d+4 for 1 FP/second at reach 2, but skill 20 without WM would let you maintain 2d for free at reach 2 or 3d for 1 FP/second at reach 3. At that point, you have to ask yourself how often you're going to want to do Rapid Strikes.

High spell skill is also a nice thing to have when you want to maintain several spells (e.g., two Flame Jets) or deal with low mana.
__________________
Sean "Dr. Kromm" Punch <kromm@sjgames.com>
GURPS Line Editor, Steve Jackson Games
My DreamWidth [Just GURPS News]
Kromm is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2018, 09:00 AM   #6
Juliansl
 
Juliansl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Default Re: Can you use weapon master for Flame Jet/Innate Attack(Beam)?

Thanks for the info guys! And yeah I'm aware I'll be missing out on half the benefits of Weapon Master and the points could be better spent on increasing Flame Jet skill. But Swashbuckler comes with a non-negotiable Weapon Master (Weapon skill of choice) and the damage boost allows me to pretty consistently do at least 10 fire damage allowing me to light clothes on fire (per Exp. 68). The downside however is that I won't last too long in combat.
Juliansl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2018, 09:27 AM   #7
Kromm
GURPS Line Editor
 
Kromm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Montréal, Québec
Default Re: Can you use weapon master for Flame Jet/Innate Attack(Beam)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Juliansl View Post

Thanks for the info guys! And yeah I'm aware I'll be missing out on half the benefits of Weapon Master and the points could be better spent on increasing Flame Jet skill. But Swashbuckler comes with a non-negotiable Weapon Master (Weapon skill of choice) and the damage boost allows me to pretty consistently do at least 10 fire damage allowing me to light clothes on fire (per Exp. 68). The downside however is that I won't last too long in combat.
There are ways. :)

A magic staff (Spells, p. 9) very specifically lets you shoot jets from it (Spells, p. 12) and even extends your reach. You can always buy a quarterstaff, pay the $30 to make it a magic staff, and learn the Staff skill to have a nice parry. Or buy a baton, jo, or short staff as your magic staff, wield it with a one-handed sword skill, and carry a shield in the other hand; that would give you a block, too, and a Defense Bonus that aids all active defenses.

Also, a swashbuckler has the option to boost Weapon Master from "Weapon of choice" [20] to "Two weapons" [25], which costs 5 points. If your GM allows "Jets," then "Jets and Quarterstaff" or "Jets and Jo" would be 100% legal. That would let you get WM benefits with your jets and the thing you shoot them out of.

The main downside to these strategies is spreading points across multiple skills and WM for those skills. I guess losing cutting or impaling damage could be seen as a downside, too, but burning damage is amazingly versatile.
__________________
Sean "Dr. Kromm" Punch <kromm@sjgames.com>
GURPS Line Editor, Steve Jackson Games
My DreamWidth [Just GURPS News]
Kromm is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2018, 12:11 PM   #8
Anthony
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
Default Re: Can you use weapon master for Flame Jet/Innate Attack(Beam)?

How certain are you that you want the swashbuckler profession? You can play swashbuckler-y with other professions (possibly a Bard; it depends on exactly what you want out of your character).
__________________
My GURPS site and Blog.
Anthony is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2018, 03:55 PM   #9
lachimba
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Sydney
Default Re: Can you use weapon master for Flame Jet/Innate Attack(Beam)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kromm View Post
There are ways. :)

A magic staff (Spells, p. 9) very specifically lets you shoot jets from it (Spells, p. 12) and even extends your reach.
Ok updating things wizards can do.
lachimba is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2018, 08:45 PM   #10
Juliansl
 
Juliansl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Default Re: Can you use weapon master for Flame Jet/Innate Attack(Beam)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony View Post
How certain are you that you want the swashbuckler profession? ...
Pretty certain, I don't want to be slinging spells or wading around in heavy armor. I want to be able to attack people with flame jet and dodge/block attacks at my leisure, which Swashbuckler is perfectly suited for. I will consider investing 5 more points into Weapon Master, as suggested by Kromm, so that it boosts my Jo as well as my Flamet Jet however. But my first priority is getting Flame Jet up to 15.
Juliansl is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:24 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.