Warp Affliction/Teleporting others.

[Kallatari]

Originally Posted by Plane

basing on target attribute creates problem if it is Will-based and you try to teleport something w/o will, in that case it might make more sense to use attacker's attribute

I disagree.

At its core, Affliction gives the trait to the subject. Not a variation of the trait, or a variable traits that gets modified according to the subject. It just gives the trait. So in this case, Affliction (Warp) gives the subject the Warp trait.

The affliction comes in two flavors, which you must chose when you purchase Affliction:
- Beneficial: the subject has full control of the ability while the Affliction lasts, and can use it - or not - as often as desired during the duration.
- Harmful: the subject cannot control the ability, and it is always on for the duration of the affliction, or, if an instantaneous effect, it occurs once when the affliction is first used (e.g., with Warp, the subject Warps then and there), with selectable parameters determined by the afflictor (e.g., with Warp, the destination). The subject gets to resist if he doesn't want it. So this version effectively adds a form of the "Always On/Uncontrollable" limitation to the trait being added to the character sheet (and if those limitations actually make sense, you may as well add them to the trait to reduce the cost of your Affliction.)

The fact that the subject cannot use the trait being granted to him (or forced upon him) does not in any way allow you to modify the trait being granted. If I had the beneficial version of Affliction (Warp) and gave it to a toaster, the fact that the toaster isn't conscious and therefore cannot chose to activate the Warp trait it now has on its character sheet does not mean that I can suddenly activate the Warp on its behalf. It just means I wasted a perfectly good Affliction on something that can't benefit from it. The same applies for the Harmful version. You are giving him and forcing him to use his newly acquired Warp (and not "Warp based on Bob's BL", which is not a trait you can create/define)

Looking at it another way, basing the weight on your own carrying capacity is like saying that an Affliction that granted someone 4 character points into a physical skill to give it him a skill level of DX +1 to a target with no DX (e.g., a tree), because the subject doesn't have a DX it would instead give it the skill at a level equal to your own DX +1. That is clearly not how it is intended to work. The subject simply wouldn't get the skill at all.

In the specific case of a harmful Affliction (Warp), if you want the amount of weight to be teleported to be determined by the afflictor's BL (or a BL based on his Will), that's exactly what the Exotelport limitation is about, and why it was created. The effect you are trying to define requires Exoteleport, but then you have to account for the subject's body mass as well as his equipment.

[Plane]

Originally Posted by Kallatari

I disagree.

At its core, Affliction gives the trait to the subject. Not a variation of the trait, or a variable traits that gets modified according to the subject. It just gives the trait. So in this case, Affliction (Warp) gives the subject the Warp trait.

The affliction comes in two flavors, which you must chose when you purchase Affliction:
- Beneficial: the subject has full control of the ability while the Affliction lasts, and can use it - or not - as often as desired during the duration.
- Harmful: the subject cannot control the ability, and it is always on for the duration of the affliction, or, if an instantaneous effect, it occurs once when the affliction is first used (e.g., with Warp, the subject Warps then and there), with selectable parameters determined by the afflictor (e.g., with Warp, the destination). The subject gets to resist if he doesn't want it. So this version effectively adds a form of the "Always On/Uncontrollable" limitation to the trait being added to the character sheet (and if those limitations actually make sense, you may as well add them to the trait to reduce the cost of your Affliction.)

I'm discussing the default 2nd case.

It's not just that the afflictor selects the parameters, they actually make the IQ roll instead of the target.

Originally Posted by Kallatari

The fact that the subject cannot use the trait being granted to him (or forced upon him) does not in any way allow you to modify the trait being granted. If I had the beneficial version of Affliction (Warp) and gave it to a toaster, the fact that the toaster isn't conscious and therefore cannot chose to activate the Warp trait it now has on its character sheet does not mean that I can suddenly activate the Warp on its behalf. It just means I wasted a perfectly good Affliction on something that can't benefit from it. The same applies for the Harmful version. You are giving him and forcing him to use his newly acquired Warp (and not "Warp based on Bob's BL", which is not a trait you can create/define)

If I were just going by what's written in Basic Set I'd agree, but I'm pretty sure one of the example writeups in Psionic Powers contradicts this assumption...

Yeah PP69-70

Basically the normal Malediction attack (Will vs HT) has a "based on IQ, own roll" to shift Will to IQ (not entirely clear why, since will is cheaper to buy up, many would want to leave it there)

Then that IQ roll (to hit the affliction) is combined with the IQ roll you'd roll to use warp as a feature.

I think the only way you'd be able to do that in the first place is if you were making both rolls to begin with.

This might be easier to examine if we could find a statted version of Affliction: Warp that isn't a malediction and relies on classic DX-targetting with the initial blast.

The also-fun thing about the PP versions is it's not just blending the rolls but also the prep time or spending of FP to offset penalties for lack of prep.