Help rebuilding Batman-like Supers character

[Vermillion]

Hi, I am a long time lurker, first time poster. I am playing in an online GURPS 4E Supers game (I think my GM is around here somewhere).

My character concept was for a non-powered or low-powered vigilante character in the vein of Batman or Black Panther (my main imnspiration is a little known character called Captain Africa). The character is the exiled prince of an African nation that now uses his bit-more-than-modest funds, some acquired gadgets and his training (hand to hand and African Stickfighting) to fight crime. He has a glider cape and Talons (shuriken with a falcon theme).

Thing is, after my first session, it became clear that I need to tweak the character a bit.

Here are the guidelines I am working with:
Build Points: 200
Dis ad Points: -100
TL: 8
Semi-cinematic (TBAM/WM and Talents allowed, but Wildcard Skills aren't)

Here is what I came up with (forgive the formatting, I am still getting used to GCA). And yes, this is indeed my fourth(!) attempt at this character:

Shadow Falcon v4
Age 23; Human; 5'10; 160

ST 10 [0]; DX 12 [40]; IQ 12 [40]; HT 11 [10].
Damage 1d-2/1d; BL 20 lbs.; HP 11 [2]; Will 12 [0]; Per 14 [5]; FP 12 [3].
Basic Speed 5.75 [0]; Basic Move 5 [0]; Block 10 (Cloak); Dodge 9; Parry 12 (Karate).

Social Background
TL: 9 [0].
CF:
Languages:

Advantages
Ambidexterity [5]; Combat Reflexes [15]; Eidetic Memory [5]; Enhanced Parry (all parries) 2 [20]; Extra Perception 1 (Affects displayed Per score) [5]; Fit [5]; Flight (Controlled Gliding; Gadget/Breakable: DR 3-5; Gadget/Breakable: Size 0 or more; Gadget/Can Be Stolen: Must be forcefully removed) [8]; Gizmo 2 (Focus Limited: Can fit in a utility belt/web gear; Trait Limited: Technological Items Only) [7]; High TL 1 [5]; Independent Income (Swiss Bank Account) 3 [3]; Signature Gear (Talon Shuriken, Armor, Boots, Gloves, Bike, NVG) 2 [2]; Trained By A Master [30]; Wealth (Comfortable) [10].
Perks: Climbing Line; Cloaked; Masked; Style Familiarity (Stickfighting - African Stickfighting) [4].

Disadvantages
Charitable (12 or less) [-15]; Curious (12 or less) [-5]; Enemy (Brother/King of Home Country) (More powerful than the PC) (Evil Twin is more skilled than you and posseses abilities that you do not; 6 or less; Hunter) [-15]; Honesty (12 or less) [-10]; Pacifism (Cannot Kill) [-15]; Secret Identity (Kwame M'witu) (Imprisonment or Exile) [-20]; Selfless (12 or less) [-5]; Sense of Duty (everyone) (Large Group) [-10].
Quirks: Dreamer; Humble; Imaginative; Trademark (Falcons); Vow (Do not return home) [-5].

Skills
Acrobatics-11 (DX-1) [2]; Acting-12 (IQ+0) [2]; Aerobatics-11 (DX-1) [2]; Area Knowledge (Atlanta)-12 (IQ+0) [1]; Climbing-12 (DX+0) [2]; Cloak-12 (DX+0) [2]; Computer Operation/TL9-13 (IQ+1) [2]; Computer Programming/TL9-12 (IQ+0) [4]; Criminology/TL9-13 (IQ+1) [4]; Driving/TL8 (Motorcycle)-11 (DX-1) [1]; Escape-11 (DX-1) [2]; Fast-Draw (Shuriken)-14 (DX+2) [2]; First Aid/TL8 (Human)-12 (IQ+0) [1]; Forensics/TL9-12 (IQ+0) [4]; Hypnotism (Human)-14 (IQ+2) [12]; Intimidation-11 (Will-1) [1]; Invisibility Art-10 (IQ-2) [2]; Judo-11 (DX-1) [2]; Karate-12 (DX+0) [4]; Piloting/TL8 (Glider)-13 (DX+1) [4]; Smallsword-12 (DX+0) [2]; Stealth-14 (DX+2) [8]; Streetwise-11 (IQ-1) [1]; Tactics-10 (IQ-2) [1]; Thrown Weapon (Shuriken)-13 (DX+1) [2].
Techniques: Disarming (Karate)-13 [2]; Disarming (Smallsword)-13 [2]; Kicking (Karate)-11 [2].

A few notes:

1) I have seen in some characters (the Iron Man one in the Marvel thread in particular) that Signature Gear can apparently be used for Advantage-based Gadgets or so. Can someone clarify the idea for me? I read the "CP into cash" section, but I don't quite get how it works.

2) The Flight is supposed to be a glider cape ala Batman Begins. Would Winged apply here?

3) I tried using the Nightstalker template from Supers, but due to my lack of comprehension of the Gear rules, I think I am failing to take advantage.

4) My main issue is the skills, primarily the combat stuff. It just seems like I am not getting my points worth. Besides, I have apparently developed an ability to have electronic dice be really crappy to me. So maximizing my skill numbers so I don't look like a total dork would be nice.

Any help would be so appreciated.

[nick012000]

Do you have Ultratech? Use stuff from that copiously. Things like the Chameleon Suits and the assorted sensor equipment and whatnot would totally fit your character.

You might also want to pick up Beam Weapons (Pistols).

EDIT: Looking in Ultratech, you might want another level of High Tech Level so you can get Sonic Shurikens. They're okay, but they're entirely in character for this guy. You might also want to consider making your "normal" shurikens Superfine or Monowire (both TL 9), or . You might also want to pick up the NBC Suit and/or Battlesuit skills equal to your highest DX-bases skill; they both offer useful options in the TL 9 or 10 armor list. You might also want to pick up the Armor Familiarity Perk from Martial Arts to negate the penalty for layering armor.

Without either at TL 9, you'd want a Reflex Bodysuit, a Light Infantry Helmet, Assault Boots, and either a Visor or a pair of Armored Shades (for armoring your Hyperspectral Goggles, depending on whether you're leaving your lower face exposed or not). With NBC, replace Reflex Bodysuit with a Reflex Tacsuit. With Battlesuit, add a Light Exoskeleton.

At TL 10, replace all instances of "Reflex" with "Nanoweave", and replace the Light Exoskeleton with a Ranger Exoskeleton. The last would cost 10 CP to buy as Signature Wealth, but would be much cheaper than buying the bonuses it grants you as character traits.

[Vermillion]

Originally Posted by nick012000

Do you have Ultratech? Use stuff from that copiously. Things like the Chameleon Suits and the assorted sensor equipment and whatnot would totally fit your character.

You might also want to pick up Beam Weapons (Pistols).

EDIT: Looking in Ultratech, you might want another level of High Tech Level so you can get Sonic Shurikens. They're okay, but they're entirely in character for this guy. You might also want to consider making your "normal" shurikens Superfine or Monowire (both TL 9), or . You might also want to pick up the NBC Suit and/or Battlesuit skills equal to your highest DX-bases skill; they both offer useful options in the TL 9 or 10 armor list. You might also want to pick up the Armor Familiarity Perk from Martial Arts to negate the penalty for layering armor.

Without either at TL 9, you'd want a Reflex Bodysuit, a Light Infantry Helmet, Assault Boots, and either a Visor or a pair of Armored Shades (for armoring your Hyperspectral Goggles, depending on whether you're leaving your lower face exposed or not). With NBC, replace Reflex Bodysuit with a Reflex Tacsuit. With Battlesuit, add a Light Exoskeleton.

At TL 10, replace all instances of "Reflex" with "Nanoweave", and replace the Light Exoskeleton with a Ranger Exoskeleton. The last would cost 10 CP to buy as Signature Wealth, but would be much cheaper than buying the bonuses it grants you as character traits.

Wow I had no idea. I would have to swing it by my GM, of course. I predict that I would have to explain how I got such high technology. Then again, Wakanda is considered a few tech levels above the rest of Marvel Earth, so it may not be too bad.

But then I come back to the skill set, especially if I have to get another one (either NBC or Battlesuit).

Also, what about a HQ? Like my own Batcave or such. Nothing too fancy, I just want to know how I would implement it.

[nick012000]

Originally Posted by Vermillion

Also, what about a HQ? Like my own Batcave or such. Nothing too fancy, I just want to know how I would implement it.

Just spend 20% or less of your character's Starting Wealth on adventuring equipment, and he's assumed to have all the neccessary accoutrements of his lifestyle and Status.

Given that he's Status 0 and Comfortable Wealth, that's probably a decent upper-middle class house with a secret basement lair or something, like the Nite-Owl had in Watchmen.

[vitruvian]

Originally Posted by Vermillion

Hi, I am a long time lurker, first time poster. I am playing in an online GURPS 4E Supers game (I think my GM is around here somewhere).

My character concept was for a non-powered or low-powered vigilante character in the vein of Batman or Black Panther (my main imnspiration is a little known character called Captain Africa). The character is the exiled prince of an African nation that now uses his bit-more-than-modest funds, some acquired gadgets and his training (hand to hand and African Stickfighting) to fight crime. He has a glider cape and Talons (shuriken with a falcon theme).

Thing is, after my first session, it became clear that I need to tweak the character a bit.

Here are the guidelines I am working with:
Build Points: 200
Dis ad Points: -100
TL: 8
Semi-cinematic (TBAM/WM and Talents allowed, but Wildcard Skills aren't)

Here is what I came up with (forgive the formatting, I am still getting used to GCA). And yes, this is indeed my fourth(!) attempt at this character:



A few notes:

1) I have seen in some characters (the Iron Man one in the Marvel thread in particular) that Signature Gear can apparently be used for Advantage-based Gadgets or so. Can someone clarify the idea for me? I read the "CP into cash" section, but I don't quite get how it works.

2) The Flight is supposed to be a glider cape ala Batman Begins. Would Winged apply here?

3) I tried using the Nightstalker template from Supers, but due to my lack of comprehension of the Gear rules, I think I am failing to take advantage.

4) My main issue is the skills, primarily the combat stuff. It just seems like I am not getting my points worth. Besides, I have apparently developed an ability to have electronic dice be really crappy to me. So maximizing my skill numbers so I don't look like a total dork would be nice.

Any help would be so appreciated.

1) SG is really just for stuff you can buy with cash. Supers includes rules for starting off with mundane equipment, then adding on Gadget-limited Advantages, but for everything other than the Glider cape I think you may be better off sticking to plain SG - Advanced Body Armor from High-Tech, weapons, and the like. Actually, since you bought him High TL and are buying gear with SG rather than his merely comfortable Wealth, you should take advantage of that fact and go crazy with the TL9 gear in Ultra-Tech; it's only 2x cost for +1 TL, after all.

2) I don't think you should get Winged in addition to the Gadget lims. Even if it's legit, you're already at -80%, so there'd be no benefit to cost.

3) As noted above, for everything except the Glider cape, it looks like you're best off shopping through UT.

4) Just go through the skills you've already bought and review whether they're at the right levels. In particular, if he's a martial artist you should definitely spring for the points to boost Karate to at least DX+2, for the +2/die damage bonus. I'd say do this even if it meant sacrificing something major, up to and including even Trained By A Master. No point being a master if your actual skill is only 12-, really. But really, I'd sooner give up one of the levels of Enhanced Parry and boost the skills.

[Kromm]

The skill-level problem is a consequence of being limited to 200 points and choosing to focus unusually heavily on advantages. As presented, you have this breakdown:

• Attributes & Secondary Characteristics: 105 points.
• Advantages & Perks: 119 points.
• Disadvantages & Quirks: -100 points.
• Skills & Techniques: 76 points.

High-skill builds are possible in this regime. For instance, 200 points with -100 in disads gives you the same positive stuff as 250 points with -50 in disads, which is the model used throughout Action and Dungeon Fantasy. There, however, the standard PC invests up to 180 points in attributes and secondary characteristics, with something like 140 being the rock bottom and 160 being average. Most of the points go into DX and IQ, which is what makes skills shine. Even an "average" hero there will have one at around 15-16 (if his skills are strictly DX- or IQ-based) or both as high as 14. On top of that, nearly all of the stock templates have Talents for their core skills, and often four levels thereof.

Shifting points out of attributes and into advantages is going to cost you in the skills department. The only exception is if the advantages you're buying add to skills, meaning Talents or Talent-like traits: Charisma, High Manual Dexterity, etc. If you focus heavily on costly "new capability" traits like super-abilities, you're going to take a hit in skill effectiveness. This isn't surprising. Realize that Batman is probably a 500- to 1,000-point character!

However, there are some little things. The techniques are ineffective. Invest the points in the base skills instead and you'll have the same effective skill levels with all of those techniques, but higher base skills. And if you do that, you'll be able to pop DX up a level by stripping enough points from each DX-based skill to pay for it. This will actually raise your levels with DX-based skills you only have a point in, and will also give you +0.25 Basic Speed, in the process raising your Basic Move and Dodge.

What are the +1 HP and FP getting this character, really? He's focused on not getting hit, and lacks powers that really use FP. I'd ditch the 5 points and invest it in Craftiness 1 [5]. If you do what I said re: DX, you have Acting-12 (IQ+0) [2] and Stealth-14 (DX+1) [4]. This makes those Acting-13 (IQ+1) [2] and Stealth-15 (DX+2) [4]. If you like, drop 3 points from those skills to keep the same old levels, and raise another skill or three.

And I echo the Enhanced Parry 2 comment above. That's a big chunk of change going into what amounts to a +2 with your Karate Parry. You could buy +4 to Karate with those points, get the same Parry, get a big damage bonus (needed, at ST 10!), and have points left over. Actually, with the tricks I outlined above, you'll have enough left over that you could still buy Enhanced Parry 1 (Bare Hands) [5] and get a net +1 to Karate Parry.

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by Vermillion

A few notes:

1) I have seen in some characters (the Iron Man one in the Marvel thread in particular) that Signature Gear can apparently be used for Advantage-based Gadgets or so. Can someone clarify the idea for me?

There would be no point to using Signature Gear for Advantage-based gadgets. since all the benefits of Signature Gear are automatically part of Gadgets.

2) The Flight is supposed to be a glider cape ala Batman Begins. Would Winged apply here?

Yes

4) My main issue is the skills, primarily the combat stuff. It just seems like I am not getting my points worth. Besides, I have apparently developed an ability to have electronic dice be really crappy to me. So maximizing my skill numbers so I don't look like a total dork would be nice.

Any help would be so appreciated.

Your "Trained By a Master" is more of an impediment than an advantage. You simply aren't skilled enough to make good use of it due to your limited budget and thirst for omnicompetence. You can't be Black Panther. Black Panther is at least a 500 point character (more recent BP is a 1000+ due to a writer who likes him way too much). You don't have enough money to make good use of your tech advantage either. To be a superhero at 200 points + Disadvantages, you need to pick one thing to be really good at. This jack of all trades and master of none stuff just won't fly. As it stands, you haven't designed Batman. You've designed Robin.

[tg_ambro]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

There would be no point to using Signature Gear for Advantage-based gadgets. since all the benefits of Signature Gear are automatically part of Gadgets.

Not quit sure I understand what you mean by this.

Sig Gear, as I understand it, is coated in a thick layer of plot armor that allows the player to get his gear back if it's lost, stolen or broken. So if a sword is an important part of your characters persona, then you won't be long without it.

Gadgets, as I Understand it, have no plot protection. Meaning that to count as Gadgets they must have Breakable, Can Be Stolen, Unique, or any combo of those three Limitations.

As I read it, the benefit of Sig Gear doesn't carry over to Gadgets. Of coarse, I may have overlooked something and am quite wrong.

[vitruvian]

Originally Posted by tg_ambro

Not quit sure I understand what you mean by this.

Sig Gear, as I understand it, is coated in a thick layer of plot armor that allows the player to get his gear back if it's lost, stolen or broken. So if a sword is an important part of your characters persona, then you won't be long without it.

Gadgets, as I Understand it, have no plot protection. Meaning that to count as Gadgets they must have Breakable, Can Be Stolen, Unique, or any combo of those three Limitations.

As I read it, the benefit of Sig Gear doesn't carry over to Gadgets. Of coarse, I may have overlooked something and am quite wrong.

Since Gadgets are bought with CPs as part of the character, it's generally assumed that they're either repairable or replaceable in the long term, so even if they're damaged in combat, or stolen, your character will likely have them again in the next adventure. That's why there's an additional level of the Breakable limitation where you can't repair it, and why Unique is an additional Gadget limitation saying you can't replace it.

If there was no assumption that usually you could repair or replace Gadgets, there'd be no point to those limitations....

[tg_ambro]

Ah yes, very true. It would seem that there indeed was something I overlooked, or more likely that I tended to think of Unique Gadgets only. Learn something new everyday huh?