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Old 02-18-2020, 09:38 AM   #1
Topgunk
 
Join Date: Feb 2020
Default Speed Modifier Table

Hi,
I'm currently using the Car Wars Compendium Second Edition rules and I'm a bit confused by the "Firer is in Target's/Target is in Firer's" table on page 29. Say the firer is going 80 mph and the target is going 60 mph and the firer is in target's back arc and target is in firer's front arc then (60mph-80mph= -20)1/2= -10 mph?

I ran across this alternate table to use in another forum. The table is at the bottom of the thread: https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/166...mbat-questions


Is the poster correct that it yields the same results? It seems a little off by my calculations and do most members of this forum use this table instead?
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Old 02-18-2020, 10:48 AM   #2
Parody
 
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Default Re: Speed Modifier Table

Quote:
Originally Posted by Topgunk View Post
Say the firer is going 80 mph and the target is going 60 mph and the firer is in target's back arc and target is in firer's front arc then (60mph-80mph= -20)1/2= -10 mph?
Yes, sometimes the calculations can be negative. (So can your speed as it represents reverse in Car Wars.) We do the calculation and then use the absolute value if it's enough to get to a speed modifier.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Topgunk View Post
I ran across this alternate table to use in another forum. ... Is the poster correct that it yields the same results? It seems a little off by my calculations and do most members of this forum use this table instead?
We use the regular table from the book and our reference sheets.

I believe the table in that post works out the same. You can see that there are really only four possible results for the speed to use to figure the modifier: Half Target Speed, Half the Difference, Target Speed, and the Difference. The table part of that post eliminates the division. You still have to do the subtraction when appropriate (the *) and use the worst modifier (the **).

The easiest way to see, though, would be to throw a few situations at both and see what you find. :)
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Old 02-18-2020, 11:03 AM   #3
juris
 
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Default Re: Speed Modifier Table

What Parody said it's relative speed not positive or negative speed so ignore the (-) part. Important thing you almost never get speed modifiers in a road war (bandits in back firing forward and vice versa). You usually only get speed modifiers when you're shooting at someone 'crossing the T' in front of you at 50 mph+

Quote:
Originally Posted by Topgunk View Post
Hi,
I'm currently using the Car Wars Compendium Second Edition rules and I'm a bit confused by the "Firer is in Target's/Target is in Firer's" table on page 29. Say the firer is going 80 mph and the target is going 60 mph and the firer is in target's back arc and target is in firer's front arc then (60mph-80mph= -20)1/2= -10 mph?
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Old 02-20-2020, 12:10 PM   #4
kjamma4
 
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Default Re: Speed Modifier Table

Quote:
Originally Posted by Parody View Post
We use the regular table from the book and our reference sheets.
I created color coded cards with all the firing positions and another with the target positions. Place them how the situation at the time is and that side has the firing modifier.

I had thought I'd uploaded all of them as a file to Boardgamegeek but apparently not. :(

Here's what the ones for front firing weapons looks like:

https://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/4009902/kjamma4
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Old 02-23-2020, 06:35 AM   #5
Magesmiley
 
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Default Re: Speed Modifier Table

Try my Unwound version of the Speed targeting table:

Code:
SPEED MODIFIERS		
"Target's
Speed*			"Firer is in Target's**	
		"Left/Right Firing Arc"	"Front/Back Firing Arc"	
0-27.5			0				0
30 - 37.5		-1				0
40 - 47.5		-2				0
50 - 57.5		-3				0
60 - 67.5		-4				-1
70 - 77.5		-5				-1
80 - 97.5		-6				-2
100 - 117.5		-6				-3
120 - 137.5		-6				-4
140 - 157.5		-6				-5
160+			-6				-6

* If moving the same direction (Firer and Target are completely in each other's opposite firing arcs, i.e. Left and Right or Front and Back), reduce the Target's Speed by the Firer's Speed.		
		
		
** If firer is in multiple arcs, use the penalty for Left/Right
Same modifiers, a fraction of the confusion.
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Old 02-23-2020, 11:43 AM   #6
Parody
 
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Default Re: Speed Modifier Table

Quote:
Originally Posted by Magesmiley View Post
Try my Unwound version of the Speed targeting table:
That's the "alternate table" Topgunk was talking about.
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Old 02-23-2020, 01:49 PM   #7
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Default Re: Speed Modifier Table

Quote:
Originally Posted by Magesmiley View Post
Try my Unwound version of the Speed targeting table:

Code:
SPEED MODIFIERS		
"Target's
Speed*			"Firer is in Target's**	
		"Left/Right Firing Arc"	"Front/Back Firing Arc"	
0-27.5			0				0
30 - 37.5		-1				0
40 - 47.5		-2				0
50 - 57.5		-3				0
60 - 67.5		-4				-1
70 - 77.5		-5				-1
80 - 97.5		-6				-2
100 - 117.5		-6				-3
120 - 137.5		-6				-4
140 - 157.5		-6				-5
160+			-6				-6

* If moving the same direction (Firer and Target are completely in each other's opposite firing arcs, i.e. Left and Right or Front and Back), reduce the Target's Speed by the Firer's Speed.		
		
		
** If firer is in multiple arcs, use the penalty for Left/Right
Same modifiers, a fraction of the confusion.
So, in essence: You've "done the math" for the players beforehand?
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Old 02-25-2020, 11:08 AM   #8
Magesmiley
 
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Default Re: Speed Modifier Table

Quote:
Originally Posted by Parody View Post
That's the "alternate table" Topgunk was talking about.
That's what I get for not checking the links for the other post. I was thinking it was one posted by a different person. ;)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 43Supporter View Post
So, in essence: You've "done the math" for the players beforehand?
To an extent. It reduces the math involved and makes it more straightforward how to get the effective speed. And only one table lookup, as opposed to two. All good things for reducing pauses in game play.

To answer the original question though, it does indeed get the same results and is more comprehensible. There was a thread on the forums here when I originally came up with it which people poked at it (and which resulted in a couple of modifications to the asterisks).

I've been using it at conventions for quite awhile, and the players who have previously used the original method find it much easier to use.
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Old 02-25-2020, 01:23 PM   #9
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Default Re: Speed Modifier Table

Quote:
Originally Posted by Magesmiley View Post
I've been using it at conventions for quite awhile, and the players who have previously used the original method find it much easier to use.
[nod] That's the sort of thing I've been advocating for, in all games -- "simplicate, and add lightness" doesn't just apply to Engineering. (My SO is a Usability Wonk; she's big on stuff like "if you're worried about people having to remember stuff, don't put it in memory -- put it in the world"; I've learned quite a bit on the topic over the years. :) )
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