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Old 06-17-2019, 11:13 AM   #111
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Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
That really really really stretches what bionics means to the person on the street which is what I believe matters for this thread.
Bionics isn't what people on the street think it is. Borrowing engineering solutions from Mother Nature goes way back.


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Same goes for all the other examples in the list.

If you asked such a person to name the method of artificial embryo twinning, they would not call it cloning regardless of how it technically is. They would only count cloning of adult organisms like Dolly as real cloning.
People are often shocked when things were first out. The first televised play was in 1930. Which means people bought TVs and watched things on them before that.
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Old 06-17-2019, 06:41 PM   #112
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Did I confuse bionics with cybernetics? I doubt it.
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Old 06-17-2019, 07:54 PM   #113
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Originally Posted by Astromancer View Post
Bionics isn't what people on the street think it is. Borrowing engineering solutions from Mother Nature goes way back.
But have have you asked yourself what GURPS refers when it uses the word? Note however that at a minimum bionics must be electronic.
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Old 06-17-2019, 09:06 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by Daigoro View Post
Any use of the word bionic in GURPS agrees with the popular definition.
Except that popular definition in Webster says nothing about the artificial limbs or other bodily parts having any electronic components.

I for example have a totally mechanical heart valve which is "bionic" by the popular definition given in Webster. Heck by the definition webster give for the popular definition a clone organ would be "bionic".

"A perfect bionic arm would move and function as easily as a real arm" fits a totally biological arm that is attached even if that arm isn't that of a human being.
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Old 06-17-2019, 09:16 PM   #115
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Except that popular definition in Webster says nothing about the artificial limbs or other bodily parts having any electronic components.
.
That isn't the popular definition.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bionic

Definition of bionic
1 : of or relating to bionics
2 : having normal biological capability or performance enhanced by or as if by electronic or electromechanical devices
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Last edited by David Johnston2; 06-17-2019 at 09:36 PM.
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Old 06-18-2019, 06:38 AM   #116
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Originally Posted by David Johnston2 View Post
That isn't the popular definition.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bionic

Definition of bionic
1 : of or relating to bionics
2 : having normal biological capability or performance enhanced by or as if by electronic or electromechanical devices
-
Yet the example doesn't say anything about in that second definition being the popular one.

"The science of bionics uses knowledge about how biological systems work to help solve engineering problems. The material Velcro, for example, was inspired by the way burrs behave when they stick to your clothes, and some computer chips are now wired in ways that imitate the "wiring" of the brain and nervous system. But in popular use, the adjective bionic almost always describes artificial limbs or other bodily parts that work as much like real ones as possible. A perfect bionic arm would move and function as easily as a real arm—a goal we're rapidly getting closer to."

No mention of electronic in that and even in the example you give there is that "as if by" which shows there are exceptions for the second definition. Heck one of the use examples refers to Bionic Mushrooms which doesn't fit the electronic part. As I said before a clone arm fits that "move and function as easily as a real arm" definition which would make Frankenstein's monster "bionic"

Then you have Electromechanical:

1) of, relating to, or being a mechanical process or device actuated or controlled electrically

2) especially : being a transducer for converting electrical energy to mechanical energy

The Bionic Mushrooms fits the electromechanical part of the popular definition.

Last edited by maximara; 06-18-2019 at 06:51 AM.
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Old 06-18-2019, 07:32 AM   #117
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Yet the example doesn't say anything about in that second definition being the popular one..
It doesn't have to. The one that was on a TV show is always going to be the more popular one.
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Old 06-18-2019, 08:08 AM   #118
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Heck one of the use examples refers to Bionic Mushrooms which doesn't fit the electronic part.
That naming strikes me as being tongue-in-cheek, so I wouldn't rest any arguments on it.

In any case, I can't recall ever hearing the word bionic to refer to something apart from electro-mechanical body parts, and none of its usage in GURPS books support the broader meaning (not that it's actually used that much).

In any case, I'm not sure what this has to do with the question in the OP.
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Old 06-18-2019, 09:12 AM   #119
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This tangent arose from the argument that what defines TL 9 involves tech that is technically really old but only if you use definitions that are not commonly held by the public.
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Old 06-18-2019, 09:51 AM   #120
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This tangent arose from the argument that what defines TL 9 involves tech that is technically really old but only if you use definitions that are not commonly held by the public.
My only point in clarifying how Velcro was bionics was to point out what Jack Steele meant when he coined the term. "[T]he study of biological organisms to find solutions to engineering problems" as stated on Mr. Steele's Wikipedia page.
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