Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-19-2015, 12:52 PM   #11
johndallman
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Cambridge, UK
Default Re: Starting a Campaign, help

Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanW View Post
(perhaps the first big success of a German scrying project was to reveal the truth of Operation Fortitude?)
That's a worryingly plausible idea. It might also lead to the Germans learning for sure that Enigma was being read. And once they know that, they have a powerful disinformation tool, if they can use it sufficiently subtly.
johndallman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-2015, 08:19 PM   #12
tshiggins
 
tshiggins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Denver, Colorado
Default Re: Starting a Campaign, help

Quote:
Originally Posted by johndallman View Post
For something like this, it's perfectly reasonable to start the characters as already being members of a resistance organisation, which gives them missions and supplies. With this kind of framework, looting and money become less important - although stealing supplies from the Nazis is a perfectly sensible mission.

This means you can sensibly give the players some guidance on the kinds of characters required, and they can allocate roles among themselves - shooters, infiltrators, medic, demolitions, etc.

There is quite a lot of GURPS material that can help with this kind of campaign. The most important is GURPS WWII: Weird War II, which has a lot about various appropriate kinds of magic and weird science. You'll likely want High-Tech for details of equipment. The rest of the GURPS WWII products provide a lot of historical background, and if the campaign is going to have an action-movie tone, the GURPS Action series provide character templates and lots of streamlined rules.

One thing: the fractured nature of Nazi administration mean that a single style of Nazi magic is quite unlikely. Several competing styles that fight among themselves is likely. There's a lot of material about an ongoing occult WWII campaign here, which has several kinds of Nazi magicians and plenty of background worth stealing.
As GM, you must address this key issue. Warfare in the modern era depends on economic strength, technological superiority and industrial capacity. German industry was arguably the most technologically-sophisticated, by the late 1930s, and it had business leaders unmatched in their competence.

However, much of the materiel needed for the war effort lay outside Germany's borders -- even outside the borders of the other Axis powers. Germany had no direct control of petroleum products, and its access to rubber supplies lay across a sea largely controlled by the British Navy.

Remember, in 1938, the British Empire had started to show serious cracks, but Her Majesty's government still exercised direct control of about 25 percent of the population of the entire world. Its Navy was the largest the world had ever seen, much larger than even the U.S. fleet, at the time.

For its part, the U.S. had the greatest industrial capacity of any single nation (not counting colonies, of which we had only a few). We had ample coal, steel and other minerals within our own border, had plenty of petroleum in Texas and the desert southwest, and easy access to rubber in our own hemisphere.

By the end of the war, the Allied powers had produced seven times the number of tanks, self-propelled guns and all-important trucks than the Axis powers. We built nearly six times the artillery, mortars and small-arms, and 50 times (!) the shipping tonnage. We had 80 million troops under arms, and the Russians alone had almost as many men uniform as the 30 million who fought for all the Axis powers, combined, all by themselves.

What will drive much of the action in your campaign is the key question, "Given the superiority of the Allied wealth, industrial capacity and numbers, how could the Germans have possibly won?"

The ability to magically scry helps, a lot. Nothing multiplies force better than timely and accurate intelligence. However, quantity has a quality all its own, and even if the invasion of Normandy had failed, the ever-increasing industrial output of the Allies (U.S. industrial output accelerated for the entire duration of the war) just means they tried again the following year. They already had a foothold in Italy, and friendlies in the South of France, and control of most of the Mediterranean.

So, I think you have to look at some of the more boring types of magic seldom used by PCs, but which would profoundly impact industrial capacity. If the Germans used magic to multiply their industrial capacity, and create from scratch huge supplies of rubber and petroleum, then they might see some real potential for victory.

At that point, the single most important mission for the PCs becomes, "How did they do that?"

What sort of magic allowed the Germans to increase their industrial output so phenomenally? Can it be duplicated? Can it be destroyed? Did it require blood sacrifice, and allow the NAZIs to turn the deaths of 6 million Jews, 1.5 million Gypsies, 3 million Ukrainians, 2.5 million Slavs (mostly Poles), and hundreds of thousands of "undesirables" (gays and those with disabilities) into tens of thousands of tanks and aircraft?

After that, you need to know where they got the personnel to operate all of that stuff. Did they use magical healing in their military hospitals? Were stormtroopers magically-enhanced? Did they animate the bodies of the dead, and put them in the assembly lines, to free up living workers for military service?

If you look at the disparities between the Allies and the Axis powers, it quickly becomes apparent that the Axis had practically zero chance to win any conflict that lasted longer than a couple of years. So, you need to figure out what they did to change that, and then determine how they keep that power hidden, and what the PCs need to do to discover it -- and then either emulate it, or destroy it.
__________________
--
MXLP:9 [JD=1, DK=1, DM-M=1, M(FAW)=1, SS=2, Nym=1 (nose coffee), sj=1 (nose cocoa), Maz=1]
"Some days, I just don't know what to think." -Daryl Dixon.
tshiggins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2015, 07:48 AM   #13
whswhs
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Default Re: Starting a Campaign, help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bzro View Post
The problem I'm having is that I have no idea how to actually start the campaign. All I really have is stats for Nazi MPs and a plan for an early game mission to derail a German supply train, and the players being exposed to the secret cargo of Nazi Wizardry. Does anyone have any experience with starting rebellion/resistance campaigns? Like, having one or more of the characters being rescued or recruited by the resistance or something?
Some years ago I ran a campaign where Sauron had caught Frodo sneaking over the borders, reclaimed the One Ring, and conquered Gondor, Rohan, Isengard, the Grey Havens, the Shire, and Rivendell. The player characters were in the resistance. What I did to start the campaign off was to play the backstory: I told the players, "Tell me where your characters were when the armies of Mordor came in, and we'll trace how you got to where the resistance is. Your characters are guaranteed not to die or be crippled during these initial sessions; they'll end up with exactly the traits on their character sheets." And then we played out their travels.

That gave us quite a panorama of Middle-Earth; we had characters starting out outside Minas Morgul, in Gondor, in Wilderland, in the Grey Havens, in the Shire, and in the lands of the Dunedain. By the time we were done I had shown a panorama of all of Middle-Earth in ruins.

This isn't necessarily the right option for your campaign, but it's one way to do it.
__________________
Bill Stoddard

A human being should know how to live fast, die young, and leave a beautiful corpse. Specialization is for insects.
whswhs is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2015, 08:58 AM   #14
Fred Brackin
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Default Re: Starting a Campaign, help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bzro View Post
... Well, they might have to now. But I was thinking France because
A: Right next to Germany
B: It's the size of Texas with countless towns, ruins, and other hideouts
C: I really like The Saboteur

But yes, it might be better to have it somewhere else. Maybe Ireland.


.
Ireland would be an odd place for a Resistance game.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_n...g_World_War_II

Also, reaching across the Atlantic to attack the US while the USSR is till an existential threat would be odd, even for Hitler.

TSHiggins had many good points about the nature of industrial warfare. You probably need to work out some of the details about _how_ magic totally reversed the situation for Germany.

I would also second the recommendation of Thaumatology. It almost certainly has some material in it addressing every question you have about how to use magic. This would include things like demonic possession.
__________________
Fred Brackin
Fred Brackin is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2015, 09:25 AM   #15
T.K.
 
T.K.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Default Re: Starting a Campaign, help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nymdok View Post
Why on earth is that UNDECIDED? Get Hitler, Goebels,Goering and 2 others and make a diesel punk Voltron of evil!
Put their BRAINS into a mech! A 4-meters high construct of pure nazi awesomeness of flesh and steam and steel, controlled/guided by these guys brains!!!!!!!
OFC they're completely apparent into a bullet-proof-glass-like-aquarium-thing. They can even rotate the heads/brains around with a lot of steam and enginee turning!

Are your players experienced? If so...

"Jimmy, you just finish grabbing some rations and is returning to the community area...

Billy, you check the recently intercepted shipment of guns and is checking the last round of ammo...

Joe, on one of your dailies scheduled radio signal scans you have time to notice a very dim static that you're damn bloody sure it wasn't there earlier...BUT

before you can say anything you all hear a really damp sound...split second later an explosion hits one of your venting exists and the marching sound of troops rushing in!

Billy, you're first...what you do?"
T.K. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2015, 09:33 AM   #16
Nymdok
 
Nymdok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Houston
Default Re: Starting a Campaign, help

Quote:
Originally Posted by tshiggins View Post
The ability to magically scry helps, a lot. Nothing multiplies force better than timely and accurate intelligence. However, quantity has a quality all its own, and even if the invasion of Normandy had failed, the ever-increasing industrial output of the Allies (U.S. industrial output accelerated for the entire duration of the war) just means they tried again the following year. They already had a foothold in Italy, and friendlies in the South of France, and control of most of the Mediterranean.
Intel is brilliant. If the Germans Adopted a policy of either Mind Controlling Captains of Industry or simply scrying and hijacking major supply shipments, that could add a much needed boost to thier production.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tshiggins View Post
So, I think you have to look at some of the more boring types of magic seldom used by PCs, but which would profoundly impact industrial capacity. If the Germans used magic to multiply their industrial capacity, and create from scratch huge supplies of rubber and petroleum, then they might see some real potential for victory.
Heck teleport, snatcher, and a few other powers seem ideal here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tshiggins View Post
At that point, the single most important mission for the PCs becomes, "How did they do that?"

What sort of magic allowed the Germans to increase their industrial output so phenomenally? Can it be duplicated? Can it be destroyed? Did it require blood sacrifice, and allow the NAZIs to turn the deaths of 6 million Jews, 1.5 million Gypsies, 3 million Ukrainians, 2.5 million Slavs (mostly Poles), and hundreds of thousands of "undesirables" (gays and those with disabilities) into tens of thousands of tanks and aircraft?
The blood sacrifice of those that Germany considered undesirable is all at once the creepiest and most brilliantly evil story idea Ive read in a while. If there isnt a Weird War II Campaign in there, I dont know where it is.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by tshiggins View Post

After that, you need to know where they got the personnel to operate all of that stuff. Did they use magical healing in their military hospitals? Were stormtroopers magically-enhanced? Did they animate the bodies of the dead, and put them in the assembly lines, to free up living workers for military service?
Zombie Nazis? Brain washed drones? Magically Enhanced Aryan Fertility? Tireless Golem factory slaves seized from Jewish folklore?

Quote:
Originally Posted by T.K. View Post
Put their BRAINS into a mech! A 4-meters high construct of pure nazi awesomeness of flesh and steam and steel, controlled/guided by these guys brains!!!!!!!
OFC they're completely apparent into a bullet-proof-glass-like-aquarium-thing. They can even rotate the heads/brains around with a lot of steam and enginee turning!
RAWR!!! Can you then put FDR's Zombie brain into a Mech for an Epic battle royal! (Tank Tread not biped of course).


Dangit...this idea does have a certain contagious nature to it...

Nymdok

Last edited by Nymdok; 02-20-2015 at 09:37 AM.
Nymdok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2015, 09:37 AM   #17
Phantasm
 
Phantasm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: On the road again...
Default Re: Starting a Campaign, help

Dieselpunk necroautomotons! Their "soldiers" are corpses reanimated through Mad Science! as well as magic. :)
__________________
"Life ... is an Oreo cookie." - J'onn J-onzz, 1991

"But mom, I don't wanna go back in the dungeon!"

The GURPS Marvel Universe Reboot Project and its not-a-wiki-really web adaptation.
Ranoc, a Muskets-and-Magery Renaissance Fantasy Setting
Phantasm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2015, 09:51 AM   #18
whswhs
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Default Re: Starting a Campaign, help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nymdok View Post
The blood sacrifice of those that Germany considered undesirable is all at once the creepiest and most brilliantly evil story idea Ive read in a while. If there isnt a Weird War II Campaign in there, I dont know where it is.....
See David Brin's "Thor Meets Captain America."
__________________
Bill Stoddard

A human being should know how to live fast, die young, and leave a beautiful corpse. Specialization is for insects.
whswhs is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2015, 10:05 AM   #19
RyanW
 
RyanW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southeast NC
Default Re: Starting a Campaign, help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nymdok View Post
The blood sacrifice of those that Germany considered undesirable is all at once the creepiest and most brilliantly evil story idea Ive read in a while. If there isnt a Weird War II Campaign in there, I dont know where it is.....
I would actually avoid that. I wouldn't want to give those actions a justification, even a horrifying one.

Or, if I did, it would be someone else's hidden agenda. Some power needed a lot of deaths and didn't care where they got them, so they manipulated events to put a bunch of racist psychopaths in power.
__________________
RyanW
Free Real Estate meme: *fades in popularity*
Other memes: It's free real estate
RyanW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2015, 10:58 AM   #20
Nymdok
 
Nymdok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Houston
Default Re: Starting a Campaign, help

Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanW View Post
I would actually avoid that. I wouldn't want to give those actions a justification, even a horrifying one.

Or, if I did, it would be someone else's hidden agenda. Some power needed a lot of deaths and didn't care where they got them, so they manipulated events to put a bunch of racist psychopaths in power.
Please dont misunderstand, its certainly not for everyones taste and its certainly not my intent to trivialize the holocaust by making it a Fantasy gameable concept, but it is a supremely 'evil' basis for a game.

Nymdok
Nymdok is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
campaign advice, nazis

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:37 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.