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Old 08-11-2015, 06:28 AM   #1
Kalminos
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Default [Thaumatology] Sorcery] Enchantment rules and permanent potions.

So the sorcery book was wonderful, especially for the enchantment rules that I've always had missing from games because I didn't like the standard magic system, but I was disappointed where in the box on alchemy-

It said all permanent elixers are made to last one minute instead of permanently and there was no under the hood like there was for armor and shields to allow such enchantments anyway-

I would have liked to be able to have permanent enchantments in general, rather than the 1 fp per hour 'usually on' sort of things- where else do I get my +1 plate cuirasses? As for the potions, what would be a good way to brew a potion to become immortal and not have the unaging go away after 1 minute?

EDIT: Also this is slightly less related, but does the sorcery book also ban creating spells with an FP cost greater than one? It seems like it does but I might be misreading.

Last edited by Kalminos; 08-11-2015 at 08:20 AM. Reason: Turned a reply into an edit.
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Old 08-11-2015, 08:23 AM   #2
A Ladder
 
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Default Re: [Thaumatology] Sorcery] Enchantment rules and permanent potions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalminos View Post
So the sorcery book was wonderful, especially for the enchantment rules that I've always had missing from games because I didn't like the standard magic system, but I was disappointed where in the box on alchemy-

It said all permanent elixers are made to last one minute instead of permanently and there was no under the hood like there was for armor and shields to allow such enchantments anyway-

I would have liked to be able to have permanent enchantments in general, rather than the 1 fp per hour 'usually on' sort of things- where else do I get my +1 plate cuirasses? As for the potions, what would be a good way to brew a potion to become immortal and not have the unaging go away after 1 minute?

EDIT: Also this is slightly less related, but does the sorcery book also ban creating spells with an FP cost greater than one? It seems like it does but I might be misreading.
See page 17, in the box with the heading "High Fatigue Spells". Typically, Sorcery wants to just keep all spells at 1 FP for simplicity. No reason to not change that for your super-duper-mega-awesome spells to have high FP costs.

EDIT: For "Permanent Potions" I would go with adding Permanent to your spells: IE
Potion of Immortality: Unaging (Permanent +150, Cosmic: Immune to Dispel Magic +50%, Magical -10%) [44] = $2816. This potion makes the imbiber stop aging. This can be undone by having the subject be subjected to a Remove Curse spell or by countering it with an "Aging Potion".

EDIT: For "Permanent Enchantments" I am going to go a circuitous route and say check out the "weapon buffs" option #3. There seems to be no reason to not adapt this to other enchantments. If you want an enchantment to be permanent (IE not "usually on") just make it highly visible and bam, you're done.
Also, just design the ability without FP costs and you won't have to worry about paying FP to maintain an enchantment. If I'm reading the Enchanting section correctly, it seems to be making all the Spells into enchantments which all have a default of 1 FP to cast. Take that off the spells and go from there.

Last edited by A Ladder; 08-11-2015 at 08:37 AM.
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Old 08-11-2015, 08:46 AM   #3
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Default Re: [Thaumatology] Sorcery] Enchantment rules and permanent potions.

To make something truly permanent, you use Truly Permanent, +300%, not Cosmic, not affected by dispel.

Otherwise, Im still crunching through the enchantment section and wondering the same thing as the OP. Im not going to houserule anything until Im done though. I also wonder if removing FP costs on items will really affect anything.
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Old 08-11-2015, 08:59 AM   #4
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Default Re: [Thaumatology] Sorcery] Enchantment rules and permanent potions.

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Originally Posted by Humabout View Post
To make something truly permanent, you use Truly Permanent, +300%, not Cosmic, not affected by dispel.

Otherwise, Im still crunching through the enchantment section and wondering the same thing as the OP. Im not going to houserule anything until Im done though. I also wonder if removing FP costs on items will really affect anything.
I was more concerned about how it just says 'Spells with indefinite durations last for a flat one minute.' in the elixir box without any mention of whether 'truly permanent' does anything about this.

Last edited by Kalminos; 08-11-2015 at 09:00 AM. Reason: Adding quote
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Old 08-11-2015, 09:22 AM   #5
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Default Re: [Thaumatology] Sorcery] Enchantment rules and permanent potions.

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I was more concerned about how it just says 'Spells with indefinite durations last for a flat one minute.' in the elixir box without any mention of whether 'truly permanent' does anything about this.
That comes from the cost FP limitation on sorcery spells. So you need to remove that.
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Old 08-11-2015, 10:26 AM   #6
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Default Re: [Thaumatology] Sorcery] Enchantment rules and permanent potions.

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It said all permanent elixers are made to last one minute instead of permanently
No. It says that all indefinite-duration spells last for a minute as an elixir. That's because there's no one pumping FP into the spell to keep it afloat.

Quote:
I would have liked to be able to have permanent enchantments in general, rather than the 1 fp per hour 'usually on' sort of things- where else do I get my +1 plate cuirasses?
(A) The Under the Hood box explains why sorcerous enchantment isn't usually applied directly to armor, but has alternate rules if you wish to change this. (B) If you do make that change, it won't hurt anything to apply the third Weapon Buff option to any armor enchantments.

Quote:
As for the potions, what would be a good way to brew a potion to become immortal and not have the unaging go away after 1 minute?
For effects which are truly permanent, the fairest answer is to have an EP multiplier of 1.0 (that is, the potion's EP cost is the spell's Full Cost). I didn't go into this because very few potions are intended to have permanent effects other than those from specific spells such as Lich.

Quote:
Also this is slightly less related, but does the sorcery book also ban creating spells with an FP cost greater than one? It seems like it does but I might be misreading.
It strongly discourages it. Spells are supposed to be limited by Full Cost, not FP cost. If the GM wants to make the occasional 2-FP or 3-FP spell, that's fine, but trying to "balance" spell effectiveness with FP cost runs counter to the whole idea of sorcery.
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Old 08-11-2015, 10:40 AM   #7
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Default Re: [Thaumatology] Sorcery] Enchantment rules and permanent potions.

Ninja'd by the master with better answers. I bow to his superiority.
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Last edited by Humabout; 08-11-2015 at 10:43 AM.
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Old 08-11-2015, 10:45 AM   #8
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Default Re: [Thaumatology] Sorcery] Enchantment rules and permanent potions.

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<snip>
Wow, thanks for the detailed response PK. Does this sort of 1X EP thing also go for a 'elixir' of stone to flesh and the like? (though such an 'elixir' is far more likely to be a balm or something of the like.
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Old 08-11-2015, 10:47 AM   #9
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Default Re: [Thaumatology] Sorcery] Enchantment rules and permanent potions.

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Wow, thanks for the detailed response PK. Does this sort of 1X EP thing also go for a 'elixir' of stone to flesh and the like? (though such an 'elixir' is far more likely to be a balm or something of the like.
No, because that's not "truly permanent." It's "permanent." "Truly permanent" potions are exceedingly rare -- basically, the only things that come to mind are youth potions and lich potions. (And frankly, I'd be okay with a normal-cost, "permanent" Potion of Youth -- it'd keep you young forever . . . or until you got hit with Dispel Magic.)
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Old 08-11-2015, 10:03 PM   #10
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Default Re: [Thaumatology] Sorcery] Enchantment rules and permanent potions.

I'm slightly disappointed we're falling to imbuements for buffing and enhancing existing attacks- It's kind of hard now to figure out how to make a sword of puissance that does +1 damage or whatever else because we have to dig through imbuements. Is there even such an imbuement in that book?

I suppose I might be going about this totally the wrong way, but I'm a sucker for having the 'bland' sort of magical weapons to be made by less skilled enchanters and the less creative alongside the cool ones that have projected attack and other interesting effects for the powerful artifacts.

Edit: the same goes for accuracy. How would I enchant THAT? I don't want to use the default magic system's magic items because I don't like how the rest of that system works. Imbuements are clunky.

Last edited by Kalminos; 08-11-2015 at 10:30 PM.
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