Gurps Thaumatology S̶o̶r̶c̶e̶r̶y̶ Star Wars

[Hannes665]

Hi.

I have been reading over Sorcery and I started to think... would this not be great conversion for Star Wars Force powers?

The Advantage could be called Force Sensitivity from level 1 to 10. Force Talent and so on.

In my Gurps Star Wars games I have Light Side Points and Dark Side Points they grant extra bonuses to Force skills and "spells" (I use spell based system for my games). They are granted at character generation according to disadvantages. For every 5 points of X disads you can either get Dark Side points or Light Side points. For example Bad Temper (12) -10 would give 2 dark side points while Can´t harm innocent would give Light side points.

But that is not why I mentioned those points but rather I was thinking... could I use these points in Sorcery/Star Wars to grant bonuses like if you spend 1 Light Side point you get +2 FP to use in Hardcore improvised Dark Side power like Choke? So Jedi Knight Mullan has 5 Light Side points and he looses his cool/temper and decides to Choke Sith Master Brutus but he has to use Hardcore Improvise to do it and it´s a Dark Side power so he should sacrifice his LS points for it? Also I was thinking for someone durning to the Dark Side he could sacrifice his LS points for Character points to use to build Dark Side power. But no further down than -3 Dark Side points. Is this game breaking or?

OR does this not make sense.

[Pragmatic]

Just for the sake of my curiosity, what would you be using as your source material for Force powers?

I have both versions of d20 (original and Saga), so if you're using those, I'd be able to follow along. :-) But I don't have the (from what I understand, MUCH better) d6 version.

[T.K.]

Originally Posted by Hannes665

Hi.

I have been reading over Sorcery and I started to think... would this not be great conversion for Star Wars Force powers?

The Advantage could be called Force Sensitivity from level 1 to 10. Force Talent and so on.

In my Gurps Star Wars games I have Light Side Points and Dark Side Points they grant extra bonuses to Force skills and "spells" (I use spell based system for my games). They are granted at character generation according to disadvantages. For every 5 points of X disads you can either get Dark Side points or Light Side points. For example Bad Temper (12) -10 would give 2 dark side points while Can´t harm innocent would give Light side points.

But that is not why I mentioned those points but rather I was thinking... could I use these points in Sorcery/Star Wars to grant bonuses like if you spend 1 Light Side point you get +2 FP to use in Hardcore improvised Dark Side power like Choke? So Jedi Knight Mullan has 5 Light Side points and he looses his cool/temper and decides to Choke Sith Master Brutus but he has to use Hardcore Improvise to do it and it´s a Dark Side power so he should sacrifice his LS points for it? Also I was thinking for someone durning to the Dark Side he could sacrifice his LS points for Character points to use to build Dark Side power. But no further down than -3 Dark Side points. Is this game breaking or?

OR does this not make sense.

hmmm...I think it's backwards afaik.

Wouldn't someone with more Dark Side points be deeper on the dark side and thus stronger there? Talking in terms of mechanics and points here...

I mean, if I understand what you're saying a powerful Dark Lord Sith would need to have many LS points so he can use many DS effects? If that's so, doesn't make much sense to me

[wellspring]

Originally Posted by T.K.

hmmm...I think it's backwards afaik.

Wouldn't someone with more Dark Side points be deeper on the dark side and thus stronger there? Talking in terms of mechanics and points here...

I mean, if I understand what you're saying a powerful Dark Lord Sith would need to have many LS points so he can use many DS effects? If that's so, doesn't make much sense to me

I'd use Force Points (FP) as a universal resource, and then add a corruption mechanic stemming from using Dark Side powers, points, and actions.

[Hannes665]

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

Just for the sake of my curiosity, what would you be using as your source material for Force powers?

I have both versions of d20 (original and Saga), so if you're using those, I'd be able to follow along. :-) But I don't have the (from what I understand, MUCH better) d6 version.

I have been using as base powers those seen in the films and KOTR games. With some "help" from D6 and D20.

[Varyon]

I think I see what you're getting at here - basically, the character gives up their innate "goodness" in order to fuel evil powers. I think Corruption will serve you better there, however, particularly as I'm at a loss as to what Dark Side Points are meant to do (the relationship doesn't make much sense going the other way). The Many Roads to Hell example Corruption system (Horror p.147-148) allows characters to gain Corruption in lieu of spending FP for spells (and presumably powers) - each FP is worth 1 point of Corruption. This would probably work just fine for Sorcery, wherein a character can accept Corruption to have a better ability to improvise powerful spells (or use their known spells without burning FP).

[Hannes665]

Originally Posted by T.K.

hmmm...I think it's backwards afaik.

Wouldn't someone with more Dark Side points be deeper on the dark side and thus stronger there? Talking in terms of mechanics and points here...

I mean, if I understand what you're saying a powerful Dark Lord Sith would need to have many LS points so he can use many DS effects? If that's so, doesn't make much sense to me

No since the DS and LS points are not usually mechanical like that they are used as bonuses to DS or LS powers. The range is from DS 10 to LS 10 with 0 in the middle or 21 levels so to speak. 2 DS to 2 LS points give nothing 3-5 +1 on spells/powers (as I have been playing it) 6-8 +2, 9 +3 and 10 +4. While LS 6 would give +2 to LS powers it would be -2 to DS powers and vice verse.

Besides the LS DS I also have FPts or Force Points that is just a fancy name for Energy Reserve to use with Force Powers.

[Hannes665]

Originally Posted by Varyon

I think I see what you're getting at here - basically, the character gives up their innate "goodness" in order to fuel evil powers. I think Corruption will serve you better there, however, particularly as I'm at a loss as to what Dark Side Points are meant to do (the relationship doesn't make much sense going the other way). The Many Roads to Hell example Corruption system (Horror p.147-148) allows characters to gain Corruption in lieu of spending FP for spells (and presumably powers) - each FP is worth 1 point of Corruption. This would probably work just fine for Sorcery, wherein a character can accept Corruption to have a better ability to improvise powerful spells (or use their known spells without burning FP).

Yes you are right there. I will look at Horror and see if I can mix it in.

[Randyman]

I'd recommend the following additional sources:

1. This thread about merging Sorcery and RPM
2. GURPS Voodoo: The Shadow War
Reason: Sorcery (powers) + RPM (rituals) looks a lot like the system originally presented for GURPS 3rd in Voodoo. That system resembles the combination of known/common Force abilities and weird/strange Force rituals found in various Star Wars sources. Simply substitute your Force abilities for Sorcery powers, as discussed here, and have RPM rituals for the weird stuff.

As to Corruption, that matches well with the early* lore about the Force - that the Dark Side is a corruption of the Force, like a cancer on a healthy body.


*"Early" in the filmographic and bibliographic history of said lore, rather than "early" in the setting timeline.

[Phantasm]

I can't say much about Sorcery as part of the Force, except that my own "Giving Force Powers the GURPS Psionic Powers Treatment" thread might be a good base. Feel free to add your own Sorcery-based Force powers to the thread.

On the deal with Light Side/Dark Side Points, I took a page from Power-Ups 5: Impulse Buys:

Special: All Force Sensitives start play with 5 Light Side Points and 5 Dark Side Points (collectively, Force Points) with which to influence die rolls (as per Power-Ups 5: Impulse Buys). Those without the Force Sensitive trait start play with 5 Action Points for the same purposes. These reset at the start of every session, except when we pause during a fight. See also Dark Side Taint, below, for additional information.

Dark Side Taint
-3 points per level
Calling upon your darker emotions - anger, fear, hate, lust, vengefulness, etc - to give a boost to your use of the Force is the path to the Dark Side. Using Dark Side Points for any purpose - even in the pursuit of noble ends! - means the Force user has to roll once that day verses his Will plus the highest of any of his Force Power Talents at a penalty equal to the number of Dark Side Points used that day to avoid accumulating Dark Side Taint. If a character uses Light Side Points to influence this roll, he permanently loses those Light Side Points. A Force User may gain up to 10 levels of Dark Side Taint; at that point, he should lose all virtuous disadvantages (possibly replacing them with less benevolent counterparts).

Please note that while it is possible to use earned XP to buy off the Taint, this should only be available following an extended period of not using the Dark Side for any reason, possibly only after using Light Side Points to influence rolls rather than Dark Side Points. It is always the GM's call as to whether a character can buy off any levels of Taint.

I based the Dark Side Taint off the "Black Magic" rules in Magic and the more generic "spiritual corruption" rules in Thaumatology. YMMV, of course, but I found in play they seemed to capture the feel of the Dark Side from the movies.