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Old 02-09-2019, 07:43 PM   #101
naloth
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Default Re: GURPS Supers Alternatives

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Originally Posted by DreadDomain View Post
Wonder Woman - 1533 pts
Which version are you trying to make her closer to?

Quote:
CHARACTERISTICS [140]
ST 60 DX 16 IQ 13 HT 14
HP 60 Per 13 Will 15 FP 14
Thr Dam 13d BL 1 ktons Speed 8 Move 8
Attributes can be a pain... ST and HT are reasonable, even low for some sources. DX seems high, but Diana has had thousands of years of training which would justify her better than the best human gymnasts. IQ seems somewhat high, but it could be that she just doesn't exert it much.

Quote:
Crushing Fist
Is this a variant of the Striking Surface perk or something else?

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Bracelets Deflection Defense Bonus +2 plus Damage Resistance 15, Active Defense, Front plus Reflection, Ranged Attacks only, AA: Blast [19]
Skill Adaptation Karate [1]
You might look into Cosmic Defenses (Block). Diana seems like a good fit for being able to block things you can't normally block.

Quote:
SHORTSWORD • Gadget: Can Be Stolen (Quick Contest, Disarm)
Sword Swing ST-Based cut damage, Armor Divisor (2), Melee Attack (1), ST-Based, AA: Sword Thrust [19]
Sword Thrust ST-Based imp damage, Armor Divisor (2), Melee Attack (1), ST-Based [103]
Weapon Bond [1]
I haven't used the Alt Gurps 3 natural weapon rules, but from what I'm seen they would fit better than ST-Based in this case.

Quote:
MAGIC LASSO • Gadget: Can Be Stolen (Quick Contest, Disarm), Unique
Lasso Grab Binding 40, Accurate 4, Reduced Range (10 yrds) [36]
Truthsayer Mind Probe, Follow-Up, Reliable 10, Hearing-Based [26]
Swingline [1]
The problem with binding is that it's normally broken/destroyed to get free. I considered doing the magic lasso as stretching with force extensions, but decided against it. It's funny to think of it as an extra long arm that with mind probing powers.

Nice build. It fits reasonably well with your ~1500 Superman. Now you need to do an Aquaman, Batman, and Flash for that point level ;)
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Old 02-09-2019, 08:56 PM   #102
DreadDomain
 
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Default Re: GURPS Supers Alternatives

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Originally Posted by naloth View Post
Which version are you trying to make her closer to?
Generic comic book version as opposed to movie version (that is why she has flight). Basically a version that could be on the same team with my Superman. Comic book characters are so fluid that I do not want to worry much about te minutea. There are really two lenses I want these characters to pass. 1) Yep, feels like superhero xyz to me and 2) yep, the build make sense mechanically.

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Originally Posted by naloth View Post
Attributes can be a pain... ST and HT are reasonable, even low for some sources. DX seems high, but Diana has had thousands of years of training which would justify her better than the best human gymnasts. IQ seems somewhat high, but it could be that she just doesn't exert it much.
WW ST has greatly varying. I ended up at 60 because it felt very WW and damage seemed balanced with Big Blue (as in less damage but still threatening). HT was a thumb suck. HT is tricky because too high makes the character nearly impervious and too low makes then too vulnerable. That band is somewhat narrow. DX and IQ were driven by character concept but also by points efficiency with regards to skills. I started with DX 14 and IQ 12 but skills made me push them upwards. I even reduced some skills because point efficiency was leading towards IQ 14 and I simply could not have that.

For a Super game GURPS has just too many narrow skills, which drive the attributes up. I have reduce my skil list to about 100 to 125 but I believe it is still too much. A better solution would be to have broader skills without necessarily going full Wildcard.

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Originally Posted by naloth View Post
Is this a variant of the Striking Surface perk or something else?
It's your variant described in this thread.

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Originally Posted by naloth View Post
You might look into Cosmic Defenses (Block). Diana seems like a good fit for being able to block things you can't normally block.
Ok, will look into it.

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Originally Posted by naloth View Post
I haven't used the Alt Gurps 3 natural weapon rules, but from what I'm seen they would fit better than ST-Based in this case.
Are you talking about the Pyramid issue? I will look at it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by naloth View Post
The problem with binding is that it's normally broken/destroyed to get free. I considered doing the magic lasso as stretching with force extensions, but decided against it. It's funny to think of it as an extra long arm that with mind probing powers.
There are two ways to get out of the snare. Break free (quick contest of ST) or to break the bind. Within the context of the special effect, damaging the bind does not destroy the lasso (which is unbreakable) but "loosen" the noose and make it easier to escape. I am personally quite happy with that interpretation.


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Originally Posted by naloth View Post
Nice build. It fits reasonably well with your ~1500 Superman. Now you need to do an Aquaman, Batman, and Flash for that point level ;)
That's the plan... eventually...
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Old 02-09-2019, 09:20 PM   #103
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Default Re: GURPS Supers Alternatives

Last year I hammered out a version of Wonder Woman, though not using KYOS. Also lacks her gliding/flight.
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Old 02-09-2019, 09:22 PM   #104
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Default Re: GURPS Supers Alternatives

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Originally Posted by naloth View Post
I haven't used the Alt Gurps 3 natural weapon rules, but from what I'm seen they would fit better than ST-Based in this case.
I just read it and I am somewhat confused. I like the rules but I am unclear if should apply by dice of damage you make with your ST (as per Power p.146) or if it is simply built as a Striker. If the latter, it would be a lot cheaper!! Also, can it then be transformed into a weapon (gadget)?

Shortsword
Impaling (thr) and Cutting (sw); Armor Divisor (2) +50%, Extra Damage Type +20%, Extra Reach +20%, Resilient (Unbreakable) +40%, Swing-Capable (Cutting) +20%, Gadget; Can be Stolen (Disarm) -30% [18]

Did I get that right?
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Old 02-11-2019, 07:42 PM   #105
naloth
 
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Default Re: GURPS Supers Alternatives

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Originally Posted by DreadDomain View Post
I just read it and I am somewhat confused. I like the rules but I am unclear if should apply by dice of damage you make with your ST (as per Power p.146) or if it is simply built as a Striker. If the latter, it would be a lot cheaper!! Also, can it then be transformed into a weapon (gadget)?
I don't see why it can't be a gadget. It fits much better than a striker since you have to "wield" it with a hand. I'm not quite sure which enhancements you would need to pay extra for "ST-Based" but most do not.

Quote:
Shortsword
Impaling (thr) and Cutting (sw); Armor Divisor (2) +50%, Extra Damage Type +20%, Extra Reach +20%, Resilient (Unbreakable) +40%, Swing-Capable (Cutting) +20%, Gadget; Can be Stolen (Disarm) -30% [18]
As far as I know, yes. AD is the only one I would question, and I saw it posted elsewhere here that it's allowed on Natural Weapons.
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Old 02-11-2019, 08:10 PM   #106
naloth
 
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Default Re: GURPS Supers Alternatives

The team no one asked for and probably didn't think anyone would ever *bother* writing up. Yes, they are somewhat of a joke but some of the powers and combinations are interesting. I gave them all Code of Honor (Comics) as enthusiastic heroes that are trying to live up to certain ideals (and usually getting hurt in the process). These would be semi-suitable for a 250 points semi-serious street level game. Here is a rough draft of the Great Lakes Avengers (original team):

Big Bertha
ST 10 BL20 Thr 1d-2 [ 0 ]
DX 11 [ 20 ]
IQ 12 [ 40 ]
HT 13 [ 30 ]
Speed 6 [ 0 ]

Appearance: Very Beautiful (Not with DR -10%) [ 15 ]
DR 15 (Skin -20%; Switchable +10%; Super -10%) [ 60 ]
HP +10 (Only with DR -10%; Super -10%) [ 24 ]
Reputation (+2/-2) [ 0 ]
Status 1 (from wealth) [ 0 ]
Lifting ST +10 (Only with DR -10%; Super -10%)) [ 48 ]
Super Jumping 3 (x8, 17’ high; Bouncing +50%; Only with DR -10%; Super -10%) [ 39 ]
Wealth: Very Wealthy [ 30 ]

Very Fat (Only while using DR -10%; Super -10%)) [ -4 ]
Code of Honor (Comic) [ -15 ]

Brawling-12 (DX+1) [1]; Model!-12 (WC) [24]; Pilot-12 (DX+1) [4] [ 29 ]

Total: 316

I did not include a lot of disadvantages, but if I had Bertha would be a split personality. Silly, somewhat impulsive, and aggressive in her super form but stuck up and reserved as a model. She is also has the most to lose from discovery, as looking like Big Bertha would probably cast a shadow on her modelling career.

Big Bertha is a fashion model that has the ability to increase her size and density. I considered growth, but decided that lots of mass (HP) was good enough. In her normal form she's a semi-famous, slender, fashion model. When she turns on her "fat form", she bloats up with lots of extra mass. Big Bertha resists damage pretty well and tends to be both bouncy and spongy. She attacks by either slamming (move 6, hp 20) or by grappling (sitting on people). In retrospect, I'll swap Brawling with Sumo Wrestling. Bertha also provides the team transport. She owns a small jet and is a fairly talented pilot.

Doorman
ST 12 BL 32 Thr 1d [ 20 ]
DX 12 [ 40 ]
IQ 12 [ 40 ]
HT 12 [ 20 ]
Speed 6

Combat Reflexes [ 15 ]
DB2 (Super -10%) [ 24 ]
Permeation (All; Affects Others +50%; Super -10%) [ 112 ]
Walk on Air (Super -10%) [ 18 ]

Code of Honor (Comic) [ -15 ]
Guilt Complex [ -5 ]

Total: 269

Doorman allows anyone touching his body to pass through any barrier, no matter how thick. He's listed as a teleporter, but Permeation works much better in GURPS terms, and it makes quite a unique and useful ability... for others. He also avoids being injured pretty well (Dodge 12, Power Dodge 12, might as well go AoD since he can't do much else). His other abilities allow him to get around and defend a bit, but he doesn't have any skills or abilities to accomplish anything. As a PC, you would want to round him out as a skulker with a decent themed attack.

Dinah Soar
ST 16 BL 80 Thr 2d [ 50 ]
DX 13 [ 60 ]
IQ 11 [ 20 ]
HT 11 [ 10 ]
Speed 6

Claws (Cutting) [ 5 ]
Enhanced Move 2 (Top Speed 48; Flight) [ 40 ]
Extra Arms (Foot-Arms -30%; Short -50%) [ 4 ]
Flight (Winged -25%) [ 30 ]
Language (Alien; Native) [ 0 ]
Language (English) [ 4 ]
Neutralize (Decreased Duration 1/30 -20%; Ranged +40%; Only Supers Sonics -20%) [ 50 ]
Perk: Longevity [ 1 ]
Ultrasonic Hearing [ 5 ]
Ultrasonic Speech [ 0 ]

Code of Honor (Comic) [ -15 ]

Aerobatics-12 (DX-1) [2]; Brawling-14 (DX+1) [2] [ 4 ]

Total: 268

Dinah is an alien flyer whose voice is in the supersonic range. She appears as one of the more sensible members, but that's probably because remaining quiet has its advantages. Dinah can carry with her feet (foot arms) and claw with them, but not wield a weapon. Both her hands and feet are covered in sharp (cutting) claws. Dinah can interrupt sonic powers, but really hasn't demonstrated any other sonic abilities except calming Mister Immortal when he's berserk. Of course, as a friend and loved one, she would get to try that anyway.

Flatman
ST 12 BL 32 Thr 1d [ 20 ]
DX 12 [ 40 ]
IQ 12 [ 40 ]
HT 12 [ 20 ]
Speed 6 [ 0 ]

Combat Reflexes [ 15 ]
Constriction Attack (Engulfing +60%; Only while flat -10%; Super -10%) [ 21 ]
DR 15 (Flat mode; Skin -20%; Switchable +10%; Super -10%) [ 60 ]
Enhanced Dodge 2 (Only while flat -10%; Super -10%) [ 24 ]
Flexibility (Only while flat -10%; Super -10%) [ 12 ]
Lifting ST +12 (Only while flat -10%; Super -10%) [ 58 ]
Stretching 4 (Only while flat -10%; Super -10%) [ 20 ]

Code of Honor (Comic) [ -15 ]

Acting-12 (IQ) [2]; Wrestling-14 (DX+2) [8] [ 10 ]

Total: 325

Flatman is a moderately powerful stretchy grappler. He's a lot like Mr Fantastic light, and got his start impersonating Mr Fantastic. He's effectively ST24 for grappling (movie Cap range) with the ability to engulf foes.

Mister Immortal
ST 15 BL 63 Thr 2d-1 [ 50 ]
DX 12 [ 40 ]
IQ 10 [ 0 ]
HT 12 [ 20 ]
Speed 6 [ 0 ]

High Pain Threshold [ 10 ]
Perk: Longevity [ 1 ]
Regeneration (Instant; Only while “dead” -20%; Super 10%) [ 70 ]
Unkillable 3 (Super -10%) [ 135 ]

Berserk [ -10 ]
Code of Honor (Comic) [ -15 ]
Impulsiveness [ -10 ]
Manic-Depressive [ -20 ]

Acrobatics-12 (DX) [4]; Boxing-14 (DX+2) [8] [ 12 ]

Total: 283

Rounding out the group is the team leader (by virtue of having recruited the rest, not due to any leadership skills or traits) Mister Immortal. His sole power seems to be that he can't die permanently. When killed he comes back to life, fully heals, seconds to minutes after he is killed. Nothing has ever interfered with this for long, and it's been stated he'll be around long after everyone else is dead.

I filled in more disads than usual for him, since part of his charm is that he tends to flip out (especially just after coming back from the dead), be impulsive, and alternate from overwhelming enthusiasm and total depression.
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Old 02-11-2019, 10:05 PM   #107
Culture20
 
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Default Re: GURPS Supers Alternatives

For Flatman, don’t forget Status:1 (Doctor) and Secret: Not really a doctor of anything, even “stuff” (Serious embarrassment and loss of status)
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Old 02-12-2019, 06:28 AM   #108
DreadDomain
 
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Default Re: GURPS Supers Alternatives

Quote:
Originally Posted by naloth View Post
I don't see why it can't be a gadget. It fits much better than a striker since you have to "wield" it with a hand. I'm not quite sure which enhancements you would need to pay extra for "ST-Based" but most do not.


As far as I know, yes. AD is the only one I would question, and I saw it posted elsewhere here that it's allowed on Natural Weapons.
I ended up not using Natural Weapons because it seemed too much of a good deal. For her shortsword, because I only apply an enhancement on the weapon's damage, I used the rules for melee weapons in P-U 4: Enhancements p.10 which are consistent with the rules in Powers.

For her shield, bracelets and lasso, because I add abilities to the weapons, I ended up recreating them with the gadget limitation. I believe I have considered all your comments and will post a revision tomorrow.
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Old 02-12-2019, 07:16 AM   #109
naloth
 
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Default Re: GURPS Supers Alternatives

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Originally Posted by Culture20 View Post
For Flatman, don’t forget Status:1 (Doctor) and Secret: Not really a doctor of anything, even “stuff” (Serious embarrassment and loss of status)
Secret could certainly work since he pretends he's something else. Not sure about status since that carries a higher cost of living. That that know him probably react to it as an OPH (-5 pts) that is annoying ("know it all", "pretends he's smarter", "uses Mr Fantastic's reputation"). It could also be a potential enemy ("mistaken for Mr Fantastic by those out for revenge") ?
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Old 02-13-2019, 01:12 PM   #110
DreadDomain
 
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Default Re: GURPS Supers Alternatives

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Originally Posted by naloth View Post
I don't see why it can't be a gadget. It fits much better than a striker since you have to "wield" it with a hand. I'm not quite sure which enhancements you would need to pay extra for "ST-Based" but most do not.


As far as I know, yes. AD is the only one I would question, and I saw it posted elsewhere here that it's allowed on Natural Weapons.
I forgot to mention that AD is used to build at least one example in the article (Wolverine's claws) so it must be legit.

I also realised Natural Weapon would be another nice way to build Superman's Freezing Breath.

And sorry for not commenting your latest characters. I have limited time and I am not super familiar with some of them.
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