10-13-2015, 02:05 PM | #11 |
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: UK
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Re: [Supers] Damage Resistance for Brick-type heroes
Okay, this is starting to make a whole lot more sense.
I think Flexible is not what Flying Bricks have. Just 5 points of crushing damage would inflict a 1 HP injury, even against DR 100. That would mean any normal person could kill Superman with a baseball bat (if he held still long enough). That leaves the remaining -20% to be divided between the two Agents. Looking at it from the other side, Blood Agent is the greater limitation of the two; it doesn't just need to touch skin, like Contact Agent, it also needs to hit a mucous membrane or an open wound. Reading the RAW again, an attack with Blood Agent is apparently incapable of creating such a wound, that would need to be a Follow Up, for which the carrier attack needs to penetrate DR first. Reading it this way, that would mean that Tough Skin provides protection against neither Agents nor Follow Ups, even if the carrier attack does not penetrate DR. However, Flying Brick DR does protect against Follow Ups (Superman is impervious to snake bites), but not against Contact Agents (bare skin, touch only - you can shake Superman's hand) nor Blood Agents (if they hit a membrane or find a pre-existing wound - Action Comics #1 showed Superman being affected by some sort of gaseous irritant). Tough Skin: Flexible -20% Not Against Follow Ups -?% Not Against Contact Agents -?% Not Against Blood Agents -?% Total: -40% Flying Brick DR: Not Against Contact Agents -?% Not Against Blood Agents -?% Total: -?% What do you think? Also, how would you name this modifier? Last edited by CeeDub; 10-13-2015 at 02:54 PM. |
10-13-2015, 05:32 PM | #12 |
Join Date: Mar 2013
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Re: [Supers] Damage Resistance for Brick-type heroes
How do you figure superman (in specific) can be harmed by a resonatory or contact attact? Unless of course the Attack is laced with some green k?
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10-13-2015, 05:55 PM | #13 |
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: UK
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Re: [Supers] Damage Resistance for Brick-type heroes
It was shown in one of his first appearances (although not in Action Comics #1, as I thought earlier). Granted, those were the days of Early Installment Weirdness, when Supes could not even fly yet and could be injured by "a bursting shell".
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10-13-2015, 11:30 PM | #14 |
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: United Kingdom of Great Britain and some other bits.
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Re: [Supers] Damage Resistance for Brick-type heroes
'Not against follow-ups' shouldn't be a valid limitation on DR, since follow-ups which are attached to a penetrating attack already ignore DR.
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10-14-2015, 12:42 AM | #15 | |
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: UK
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Re: [Supers] Damage Resistance for Brick-type heroes
Quote:
Example: Achilles, the DR 1000 (Tough Skin, -40%) superhero, gets attacked by a regular, garden-variety rattlesnake. Achilles has Overconfidence regarding his own invulnerability, ignores the warning rattle and does not use active defense to dodge. The snake bites his naked calf. The fangs are stopped by his Tough Skin and don't sink into his flesh - he takes 0 damage/injury, but since he has the Tough Skin modifier, the fangs make enough of a scratch for the venom to seep into. Oops. Let's hope Achilles' player didn't also suffer from Overconfidence and dump-stat Achilles' HT attribute. ETA: Please note that I'm not arguing against how Tough Skin works or how it's priced, it makes perfect sense IMO. It's just not the kind of modifier that models the kind of DR you see in the comics, which is what I'm looking for, and neither are Flexible or unmodified DR. Last edited by CeeDub; 10-14-2015 at 12:47 AM. |
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10-14-2015, 01:08 AM | #16 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: United Kingdom of Great Britain and some other bits.
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Re: [Supers] Damage Resistance for Brick-type heroes
Quote:
The follow-up only gets past DR because it's a blood agent. An explosive or incendiary follow-up wouldn't be able to get through the DR. Likewise, a blood agent which wasn't a follow-up would bypass the DR if it hit the scratch, thanks to being linked to the initial attack or simply splashed across the wound. |
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10-14-2015, 02:44 AM | #17 | |
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: UK
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Re: [Supers] Damage Resistance for Brick-type heroes
Quote:
Looking from the other side again, if it was just 'Not Against Blood Agents', Venomfang the supervillain could just spit his haemotoxin across Achilles' bare chest and have it take effect. That's not what's happening with Tough Skin. Conversely, if Tough Skin didn't include a limitation against Follow Ups, you'd have to (1) attack with a knife/fang/whatever first, (2) hit, (3) penetrate any DR worn on top of the Tough Skin, (4) then attack in the next round with your Blood Agent, and (5) hit the same location again, this time ignoring any DR. That's a much more serious limitation than "(1) hit and (2) penetrate any DR worn on top of the Tough Skin". Also, according to the RAW, Tough Skin explicitly permits any Follow Up that requires a scratch or skin contact, poison was only given as an example. Last edited by CeeDub; 10-14-2015 at 04:42 AM. Reason: Clarified distinction between 'Not Against Follow Ups' and 'Not Against Blood Agents' |
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10-14-2015, 06:32 AM | #18 |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: On the road again...
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Re: [Supers] Damage Resistance for Brick-type heroes
Have you looked at Force Field? A lot of writers have stated that Superman's invulnerability is essentially a skin-tight force field, which is why he's been shot in the eye and deflected the bullet without blinking, taking no damage (and not even showing any pain).
Force Field modified with an "Accessibility: Not Against Contact Agents, -10%", for a total price of +18% (listed as "Force Field (+20%; Accessibility, -10%), +18%" on a sheet) might model the effect you're going for.
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10-14-2015, 06:34 AM | #19 |
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
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Re: [Supers] Damage Resistance for Brick-type heroes
Blood agents require better contact than bare skin. They require BLOOD contact, or mucus membranes, eyes, and other particularly delicate surfaces. Skin is designed to keep crap out, those membranes are not. Heck, many of them are designed to absorb materials.
Contact agents require touching bare skin (or mucus membranes or whatever). Melee attacks just require thumping them (on the clothes, the armor, the skin, whatever).
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10-14-2015, 07:48 AM | #20 | ||||
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: UK
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Re: [Supers] Damage Resistance for Brick-type heroes
I have, and I'm re-evaluating it again, but IMO the modifier I'm looking for is a limitation, not an enhancement.
RAW against a naked superhero with DR 1000 (Tough Skin, -40%): Quote:
Against a naked Flying Brick-type superhero with DR 1000 (unknown modifier): Quote:
To illustrate why this is a limitation compared to unmodified DR: RAW against a naked Flying Brick-type superhero with DR 1000, compared to the unknown modifier: Quote:
Quote:
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damage resistance, tough skin |
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