09-22-2017, 04:15 PM | #41 |
Join Date: Feb 2008
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Re: It would be nice to have some AD&D style demons and devils
That is the Pathfinder cosmology. Devils serve asmodeus and either used to be celestials who sided with asmodeus in the beginning or they are crafted out of individual mortal soul tormented and stripped of their identity. The end goal for hell is to return existence to a state before there was free will.
Demons are made from the individual sins of mortals. Demons want suffering and destruction, but not really the end of all things because that means no more toys. Qlippoth are the original inhabitants of the abyss and they are none too fond of demons, so they want to destroy all sapient life so that nobody can sin anymore and make new demons. |
09-22-2017, 04:41 PM | #42 |
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
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Re: It would be nice to have some AD&D style demons and devils
In terms of actual play, the important distinctions have to do with what they want and what tactics they can use. Some common subtypes for desires:
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09-22-2017, 04:51 PM | #43 | |
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
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Re: It would be nice to have some AD&D style demons and devils
Quote:
If it has statistics, the players will find a way to kill it. If it doesn't have statistics, the players will probably find a way to make the GM wish they had statistics :)
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09-22-2017, 04:56 PM | #44 |
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
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Re: It would be nice to have some AD&D style demons and devils
By 'physically manifest' I mostly mean "it has a counter on the map which you can attack", not that it necessarily has to be vulnerable to mundane weapons.
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09-23-2017, 06:35 AM | #45 | ||
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Poland
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Re: It would be nice to have some AD&D style demons and devils
Quote:
Quote:
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09-23-2017, 08:32 AM | #46 |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Spain —Europe
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Re: It would be nice to have some AD&D style demons and devils
Agreed. Also, to have different factions of monsters around can be independent of the specifics of the Blood War.
For what it's worth, I want to add two clarifications to what I said: I didn't touch the angles of Qlippoth or as-Sharak because I did focus in the cosmogonical perspective from earlier posts (mainly from b-dog), and also due to the complexity of more secondary cases (but equally interesting and relevant to the genre), like demons as rotten psychic remnants of dead gods or definitely exhausted cycles, and demons caused by sorcery and curses. And I wasn't trying to say that there shouldn't be differences and peculiarities among demons (or devils). Also, concerning different cultures, along with the different names for shared notions or entities, the different imageries and other factors can justify different creatures in fantasy RPGs, even if this is easily abused.
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09-23-2017, 11:46 AM | #47 |
Wielder of Smart Pants
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ventura CA
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Re: It would be nice to have some AD&D style demons and devils
Well if it isn't vulnerable to Exorcism or attacks, I don't think it is meaningfully present in the campaign unless it is an indirect threat (which makes it no different from criminal overlords and evil emperors).
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09-25-2017, 08:25 AM | #48 | |
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
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Re: It would be nice to have some AD&D style demons and devils
Quote:
Now, I'm not sure I actually agree on that point, at least as a general rule. I'm personally fine with things like "only vulnerable to attacks by holy characters, or people with Bless on them" - which, recall, can get knocked off in a fight. Big nasty monsters needing some research or applied lore, and preparation, to conquer is only appropriate in my opinion. A more interesting way of adding a challenge to them than "more hit dice" or "more DR". That said: going with something like Kromms pattern of an enemy that's virtually invulnerable until you do the McGuffin thing while in combat with it (steal its amulet, recite the summoning ritual backwards, kill all 13 cultists sustaining it) is a fun dramatic approach. An Exorcism is a perfectly good McGuffin thing here, too.
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09-25-2017, 09:17 AM | #49 |
Wielder of Smart Pants
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ventura CA
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Re: It would be nice to have some AD&D style demons and devils
Presumably the possessed person, altar, or teapot can be represented by a miniature.
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09-25-2017, 10:10 AM | #50 |
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
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Re: It would be nice to have some AD&D style demons and devils
The key thing is really not to have the scene where certain characters are standing around sucking their thumbs because they have absolutely nothing to do. That can be accomplished by having evil cultists or something trying to interfere with your exorcism, of course.
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cosmology, demons |
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