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Old 02-26-2009, 03:38 PM   #21
Sentinel
 
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Default Re: Snickersnee and a scary clown boss question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheddar Limbo
Sentinel, the rules for the Boss fight seem to apply only to the Boss Monster itself, not to the entire battle. So in the scenario you describe it would be okay to banish another monster that was added to the fight.
If the banish card said it affected all monsters in the room(ie: handy hole grenade) would it not be usable or would it banish everyone but the Boss?

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Old 02-27-2009, 08:49 AM   #22
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Default Re: Snickersnee and a scary clown boss question

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Originally Posted by Sentinel
I had the Snickersnee and the Clowns were the boss mob. Someone wandered in a Monster. I assume I can still use cards like dispell monster to remove the wandered monster from this room/combat and then I am only left with the Boss monster which is defeated correct?
Correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sentinel
The only monster I cannot banish is the Boss monster right? How would I handle banish type cards that remove all monsters from combat? Would it remove all but the boss or would that type not be playable on the final boss fight.

Basically, are the cards allowed but the boss is unaffected or are the cards just not allowed to be played and if so which type, the single target, room target or all of the above?
The rules is that nothing can make the Boss monster go away, not that such cards cannot be played. So yes, if you had the Boss + five other monsters and you wanted to play "All monsters in this and adjacent rooms turn into pickles, which I promptly devour" you could ... and it would work, save for it would have no effect on the Boss monster.
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Old 02-27-2009, 10:24 AM   #23
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Default Re: Snickersnee and a scary clown boss question

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArcadianRefugee
"All monsters in this and adjacent rooms turn into pickles, which I promptly devour" .
Is that from "Looking For Trouble?" I'm gonna have to pick that up soon...
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Old 02-06-2011, 02:56 AM   #24
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Default Re: Snickersnee and a scary clown boss question

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Originally Posted by Progmode View Post
I'd say an "automatic defeat" counts as an "instant kill," especially given Will's response above. By definition an instant kill removes the monster from combat. That's bypassing the combat as I see it.
I don't think so. As Bob remembered, the rules state: "Some events can completely remove monsters from combat: instant kills, banishments and vanishments, cards that can move a monster away at any time, and so on. If at least one monster remains in the room, the combat continues. If any of the dead or fled monsters had Treasures or dropped any loot, it can’t be claimed until the defeat of the remaining monster(s)." (by The Rules, Page 8, Where’d Those Monsters Go?)

The point is - as Progmode wondered - is there a difference between instant killing and automatic defeat?

In my opinion, there is.

If anything allows to kill a monster instantly, the only way to prevent it is to use a card which prevents that anything (e.g. a counterspell vs a spell).
Otherwise - yes - the rule above apply - the monster would be instantly removed from combat and that's not allowed with Bosses.

But automatic defeat by means of a weapons should mean that - no matter your level, enhancers, monster levels, monster's enhancers - using that weapon will automatically cause the monster to be defeated.

Note that this isn't instantaneous at all. Other player have got 2.6 seconds to apply any curse able to cause the weapon to be dropped, to be destroyed or to lose its power.
In fact, since the effects of a weapon are computed after the die roll, and since curses may be played anytime, we could even say that they have time until the player rolls.

I wouldn't call this "instantly killing". I would rather say that if a player has got a Snickersnee and is fighting Scary Clowns, and at the time of combat resolution, he still holds this weapon, the defeat of the monster is automatic, independently from die results and other modifiers.
If he's a common monster, he dies and the player gets his level(s) and treasure(s). If he's a Boss, he's defeated, and the player wins the game.

Last edited by amir1972; 02-06-2011 at 03:16 AM.
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Old 02-06-2011, 05:12 AM   #25
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Default Re: Snickersnee and a scary clown boss question

Will (O'Keefe), who did quite a bit with respect to design and playtest, covered this officially, as did I. The Scary Clowns are instantly defeated, Boss or no, by Snickersnee. There is still a reasonable amount of time for the other players to add other Monsters to prevent this from being an instant win of the game, but that's about it.
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Old 02-06-2011, 11:21 AM   #26
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Default Re: Snickersnee and a scary clown boss question

About OP.
I would tend to consider that the Munchkin wins.
The Snickersnee is not a means to make the monster disappear, so it leads to his defeat (other potions or bonuses can be used vs the Boss and lead to victory).

I would consider that situation as a nice stroke of luck.
The fact that the Boss is easily defeated is not a reason not to accept such an occurence.
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Old 04-05-2011, 01:33 AM   #27
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Default Re: Snickersnee and a scary clown boss question

Hi, I post in this thread, since my question rely to a similar issue. Let me know if I should open a new topic, instead.
If I understood correctly, in the situation of Snickersnee vs scary clown, you have an automatic win, unless someone else plays some card like wandered monster or so (I assume you can make the clowns dissapear or move away too, in case they're not the boss).
But then, what if the clowns are in a mob, and I possess the Snickersnee?
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Old 04-05-2011, 05:23 AM   #28
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Default Re: Snickersnee and a scary clown boss question

The Scary Clowns are automatically killed, and if you can kill or defeat the remaining Monsters, you get the rewards. Otherwise, the Scary Clowns card is discarded (along with any Enhancers on it) and any survivors of the mob continue on their merry way.
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Old 04-05-2011, 06:30 AM   #29
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Default Re: Snickersnee and a scary clown boss question

Thanks Erik.

Let's see if I understood correctly.

If you fight a mob with scary clowns in, and you have snickersnee, you don't count scary clowns level and die in the combat, since they're automatically killed.
Now, in case you win, you gain levels and treasures according to the monsters you killed (included scary clowns)
But if you lose, you get damages from the remaining mosters, and you have to escape only from them.
Hmm... do you gain the level and treasures from scary clowns, even if you lose?
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Old 04-05-2011, 06:49 AM   #30
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Default Re: Snickersnee and a scary clown boss question

No. As I said in my earlier post, you would only get combat rewards after defeating the remaining Monsters. This is consistent with the rules: You don't collect combat rewards unless you defeat all the Monsters in the combat.
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