Because only a Halfling could forge the one-ring in the first place

[Skarg]

Originally Posted by hcobb

Given the 102900 XP needed to get the ST 8, DX 15, IQ 20 wizard with GMIC, at 100 XP per playing week, that's only 20 years of playing time at 50 sessions per year.

Elvin or Goblin wizards (at ST 6) would only be five years of course.

Halfling wizards (at ST 4) would be less than two years.

Which points to the (unintended, I expect) consequence of wording the XP table in terms of attribute totals for 32-point starting characters, not taking into account the effect on non-humans who start with different points.

(Just one of the places the XP rules as written need attention.)

[larsdangly]

Originally Posted by TippetsTX

TBH, I find the assumption of 50-100 XP per session problematic as well whether you are looking at XP progression by RAW or even some of the revised schedules that have been proposed in other threads.The premise that the rate at which a PC can earn XP remains flat over the course of their adventuring career is flawed IMO.

I may open a new thread to discuss this in more detail.

This is very much in your control without violating RAW. The rates and mechanisms of XP award are vague and at the GM's discretion, with a few numbers offered as suggestions. If you want to ramp it up I don't see anyone arguing the contrary. I wouldn't do it myself because I like the slow progression schedule. But I think its clear everyone is free to do what they want in this respect.

[platimus]

Originally Posted by Skarg

Which points to the (unintended, I expect) consequence of wording the XP table in terms of attribute totals for 32-point starting characters, not taking into account the effect on non-humans who start with different points.

(Just one of the places the XP rules as written need attention.)

You know, when I started that "FOR STEVE" thread I was quite sure that was an oversight. As time has passed, I'm less sure. I'm anxious to get the next version of the PDF to see if was changed before going to press.

[platimus]

Originally Posted by larsdangly

This is very much in your control without violating RAW. The rates and mechanisms of XP award are vague and at the GM's discretion, with a few numbers offered as suggestions. If you want to ramp it up I don't see anyone arguing the contrary. I wouldn't do it myself because I like the slow progression schedule. But I think its clear everyone is free to do what they want in this respect.

Amen, Brother Lars! Handing out more XP seems WAY easier than rewriting XP rules.

[TippetsTX]

Originally Posted by larsdangly

This is very much in your control without violating RAW. The rates and mechanisms of XP award are vague and at the GM's discretion, with a few numbers offered as suggestions. If you want to ramp it up I don't see anyone arguing the contrary. I wouldn't do it myself because I like the slow progression schedule. But I think its clear everyone is free to do what they want in this respect.

Yes, and that is fine for me, you and the rest of us who have been running various RPGs for the last 20-30 years. But what about new GMs and players? Shouldn't there be guidelines for them beyond a simple suggested range of XP to award per session? I'm not saying it has to be as granular as what was presented in the original rules, but just saying "meh, just swag the XP however you think is fine" seems a bit lazy to me.

[Skarg]

Originally Posted by TippetsTX

Yes, and that is fine for me, you and the rest of us who have been running various RPGs for the last 20-30 years. But what about new GMs and players? Shouldn't there be guidelines for them beyond a simple suggested range of XP to award per session? I'm not saying it has to be as granular as what was presented in the original rules, but just saying "meh, just swag the XP however you think is fine" seems a bit lazy to me.

Yes. Especially following some threads and the Discord server where new people are excited about learning TFT for the first time and wanting to experience it and learn what it's like, and who have few preconceived ideas or understanding of much of anything.

That was the advantage of the original mechanical systems, and one reason I'm glad there are still some mechanical systems left in the new basic Melee/Wizard and Death Tests - new people who use those will at least get a point of reference to experience.

[larsdangly]

An option as another 'out' is to use Melee and Wizard to brew up your campaign characters. Many characters will die in the arena within a few fights, but you can easily get a character to 40 points in the arena combat game within a few weeks of play. Heck, if you order 2 pizzas and get a case of beer in your fridge you could probably get a character to 40 points in one weekend of play.

[ecz]

this is my approach:

in the old TFT a farmer was able to save enough money to buy a stone flesh (for example) in a few months because in my world wizards and guilds were VERY common, thus the listed price looked fair to me at beginning. Then, when we saw an inflation of magical objects, we started to put increasing limits via two house rules:
1) not always the requested item is available at the shop: the Hero must return in 1d6 weeks, and later we extended the booking time in 3d6 weeks (plus the time to create the object);
2) we doubled the listed price because any error in the creation process (not just a critical failure) forces the wizard to restart. Thus price doubled and also time doubled to evade orders.

We had some wizards creating their own magical objects by themselves, but generally everyone used the local guild to order his favorite tool, payment in advance, and at least the double of the number of weeks listed to wait.

This approach keep the number of magical objects low and acceptable and the players appreciated these house rules.
This per the old TFT.


In the new TFT it seems wizard-Characters have lost the option to realistically evolve in the direction of a Wizard creating his own magical objects and partecipate the adventures. Besides their price is much higher. It seems fine to me.

According my POV magical objects must be rare and expansive, at least in worlds, and this have been done efficently changing the creation process.

About wizard creating magical objects, I see them as a very different class of wizards totally dedicated to study, and having the opposite philosopy of the "combat Wizards". They have ST 8 and DX 15, and they work and study all the life to reach IQ 20 from the very start of their careers. As today any professional high -skill job requires.

I imagine that the best wizards works at full time for Guilds and Kings that give them everything they can need. I suppose that some magical help to reach IQ 20 is necessary and provided or regular basis, like wishes coming from demons created in an protect contest (pentagram, dozens of friendly fighters ready to fire their heavy crossbows in case of need, a gate to escape, a long distance teleport scroll handy and similia).

Then the wizard can cut the time required to reach IQ20 under the protection of the Guild/King or authority and start to work very early for the guild itself or the Army.

I see these wizards like scientists always in their labs, well protected and respected with a lot of apprendices and a staff ready for everything.

The fact a Character cannot reach such a higher level of knowledge in most cases is NOT a iussue. It's a positive change in my opinion.

In the new TFT magic becomes rarer, and more expansive. Also a Iron flesh ring becomes a great treasure.

[philreed]

Originally Posted by TippetsTX

Well, since the availability and creation of 'greater' magic items are such a core element of the setting and it's economics, yes.

GMs and NPCs should ignore the rules. Period. Create whatever works for the story.

[RobW]

Originally Posted by philreed

GMs and NPCs should ignore the rules. Period. Create whatever works for the story.

Many people will agree with you, but I disagree, especially with the "Period."

There's a long-standing debate about story-driven vs mechanics-driven RPG'ing. I like the idea of a world in which the inhabitants (ie PCs and NPCs) are all operating by the same rules, and then what happens are the unpredictable interactions between them all. A simulated world where the GM sets the forces into motion, as opposed to a story.

There are people on the forum who are interested in getting the constraints of their simulation, so to speak, in order. You can call them rules lawyers and pray for their Shakespearean deaths, but I bet they are really interested in the idea of a consistent universe, and might see themselves as creating the impetus(es?!) and forces within their RPG world and discovering how those play out, along with the players.

And you know, if some people want to discuss and debate whether a controlled fire can last for a minute or a second, or if a figure who begins movement not engaged can actually defend, where else would you expect them to go but these forums?