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Old 07-31-2018, 07:34 PM   #1
bluekitsune13
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Default How do you all handle mounted combat?

The rules for mounted combat in TFT are very detailed, with a rider able to have a different facing than the mount, as well as being able to get dismounted. My problem is I play with miniatures, and they are all one piece and glued. Plus most mounted models don't have a dismounted version of them either. This would make it hard to act out the rules as written.

I was wondering if any of you have come up with some alternate rules for dealing with mounted figures. An easy solution might be to just treat them as a whole fighter, similar to a large create like a Centaur or Troll. It would basically be all or nothing with them. That's kind of the way I'm leaning right now.
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Old 07-31-2018, 08:09 PM   #2
Skarg
 
Join Date: May 2015
Default Re: How do you all handle mounted combat?

I use counters so that and other miniatures-issues don't happen.

If I were going to play TFT mounted combat with miniatures, I would either use little markers to indicate which direction the rider is facing, or as you suggest, change the rules... there would be a few options, depending on how you'd rather it work. I'd try to balance the changes against the printed rules so they aren't much better or worse for the riders than in the printed rules.

The main issue I do have with TFT mounted combat has to do with initiative and high MA... there are some tactics that feel gamey and not very realistic if there is a lot of space and time and only one side is mounted.
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Old 10-11-2018, 10:56 AM   #3
Axly Suregrip
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Default Re: How do you all handle mounted combat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skarg View Post
The main issue I do have with TFT mounted combat has to do with initiative and high MA... there are some tactics that feel gamey and not very realistic if there is a lot of space and time and only one side is mounted.
It looks like no one talked to this aspect that Skarg points out. I have seen this too. A single mounted fighter with enough room (Wizard map often used in outdoor encounters), just zips around (horse MA 24 and Fighter may attack with horse running full speed) and picks off foes. Specially when he wins the initiative and lets the foes move first. It is like Nightcrawler teleporting all over and those on foot are at his whim.

Even mounted vs mounted can get a little weird if one mount is a bit faster.

A mounted warrior should have an advantage, but it should not feel teleporty. A horse moving full speed should have a hard time making tight turns.

How about this: if a creature with MA of 16+ moves over half MA, it may only move to hexes that are one of the three front hexes. This would be true for every hex moved.

-Alan
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Old 10-11-2018, 11:12 AM   #4
hcobb
 
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Pacheco, California
Default Re: How do you all handle mounted combat?

Stab that high and mighty mounted knight with your spear as he gallops up for a sword swing.

But I have a simple fix: Roll 2/DX whenever any figure moves more than 2 hexes in a turn and attempts to change facing by more than one hex after any hex moved. On a failure they don't change facing. On a 12 roll 3/DX or fall down.
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Old 10-11-2018, 11:50 AM   #5
platimus
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: behind you
Default Re: How do you all handle mounted combat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Axly Suregrip View Post
It looks like no one talked to this aspect that Skarg points out. I have seen this too. A single mounted fighter with enough room (Wizard map often used in outdoor encounters), just zips around (horse MA 24 and Fighter may attack with horse running full speed) and picks off foes. Specially when he wins the initiative and lets the foes move first. It is like Nightcrawler teleporting all over and those on foot are at his whim.

Even mounted vs mounted can get a little weird if one mount is a bit faster.

A mounted warrior should have an advantage, but it should not feel teleporty. A horse moving full speed should have a hard time making tight turns.

How about this: if a creature with MA of 16+ moves over half MA, it may only move to hexes that are one of the three front hexes. This would be true for every hex moved.

-Alan
I'm probably doing it wrong but that would still allow a horse to do a 180 with 3 MA. Surely no one simply let's a horse do a 180 in the 2 hexes he previously occupied (which would cost 1 or 2 MA)???

Surely no one lets a 1-hex figure do a 180 (or even 120) in his current hex and keep moving???

It would seem better to me to say that movement stops (for anyone) when their facing changes by more than 60 degrees (more than one side of a hex) from their starting facing.

Last edited by platimus; 10-11-2018 at 12:17 PM.
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Old 10-11-2018, 12:24 PM   #6
Skarg
 
Join Date: May 2015
Default Re: How do you all handle mounted combat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Axly Suregrip View Post
It looks like no one talked to this aspect that Skarg points out. I have seen this too. A single mounted fighter with enough room (Wizard map often used in outdoor encounters), just zips around (horse MA 24 and Fighter may attack with horse running full speed) and picks off foes. Specially when he wins the initiative and lets the foes move first. It is like Nightcrawler teleporting all over and those on foot are at his whim.

Even mounted vs mounted can get a little weird if one mount is a bit faster.

A mounted warrior should have an advantage, but it should not feel teleporty. A horse moving full speed should have a hard time making tight turns.

How about this: if a creature with MA of 16+ moves over half MA, it may only move to hexes that are one of the three front hexes. This would be true for every hex moved.

-Alan
Yes, that would help. I would probably attempt an easy version of what GURPS does (adding turning circles for fast movers, possibly even adding speed change limits).

There are various ways to do that.

If we want to avoid applying it to fast runners too (?), we might want to specify it only applies to mounted and flying movement.

A problem with starting the effects at MA 15+ (which I assume you did to avoid affecting Elves with Running), is that mounts can move full MA and their riders can still attack (compared to normal fighters who can only move 1/2 MA and attack), so though I haven't playtested it yet, I'd expect to want limits to kick in around MA 6 or 7 - the point where someone in no armor and running is, and the point where you can run around someone facing you two hexes away to get to their rear, if you can move freely.

* To move your mount MA 7+, you must say you are going to do so, and then move only into your front hexes, and you may only change facing by 1 hexside every 2 hexes you move. At least every other hex you move must be directly ahead into your center front hex.

* To move MA 9+, as above, and you may only change facing every 3 hexes you move.

* To move MA 11+, as above, and you may only change facing every 4 hexes you move.

And/or something like:

* If you move 1/2 MA to 3/4 your MA, you can only change facing up to 2 hexsides per turn.

* If you move 3/4 your MA or more, you can only change facing one hexside per turn.

Those numbers are coming from a quick adaptation from GURPS Basic turning circles. What actual values would work best want some playtesting I have not done yet.

Idea being you can't just zoom tightly behind opponents' front hexes to hit them in the side and rear, and if you're going really fast you need to mainly be moving the same direction or turning slightly, not doing circles and zigzags.
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Old 10-11-2018, 12:47 PM   #7
platimus
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: behind you
Default Re: How do you all handle mounted combat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skarg View Post
Yes, that would help. I would probably attempt an easy version of what GURPS does (adding turning circles for fast movers, possibly even adding speed change limits).

There are various ways to do that.

If we want to avoid applying it to fast runners too (?), we might want to specify it only applies to mounted and flying movement.

A problem with starting the effects at MA 15+ (which I assume you did to avoid affecting Elves with Running), is that mounts can move full MA and their riders can still attack (compared to normal fighters who can only move 1/2 MA and attack), so though I haven't playtested it yet, I'd expect to want limits to kick in around MA 6 or 7 - the point where someone in no armor and running is, and the point where you can run around someone facing you two hexes away to get to their rear, if you can move freely.

* To move your mount MA 7+, you must say you are going to do so, and then move only into your front hexes, and you may only change facing by 1 hexside every 2 hexes you move. At least every other hex you move must be directly ahead into your center front hex.

* To move MA 9+, as above, and you may only change facing every 3 hexes you move.

* To move MA 11+, as above, and you may only change facing every 4 hexes you move.

And/or something like:

* If you move 1/2 MA to 3/4 your MA, you can only change facing up to 2 hexsides per turn.

* If you move 3/4 your MA or more, you can only change facing one hexside per turn.

Those numbers are coming from a quick adaptation from GURPS Basic turning circles. What actual values would work best want some playtesting I have not done yet.

Idea being you can't just zoom tightly behind opponents' front hexes to hit them in the side and rear, and if you're going really fast you need to mainly be moving the same direction or turning slightly, not doing circles and zigzags.
Or just say, "A figure's movement stops if its facing changes by more than 60 degrees from the start of movement."

Last edited by platimus; 10-11-2018 at 12:59 PM.
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Old 10-11-2018, 03:31 PM   #8
Skarg
 
Join Date: May 2015
Default Re: How do you all handle mounted combat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by platimus View Post
Or just say, "A figure's movement stops if its facing changes by more than 60 degrees from the start of movement."
Any figure, for any MA? What do you mean?
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Old 10-12-2018, 07:36 AM   #9
platimus
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: behind you
Default Re: How do you all handle mounted combat?

Back to the topic of horses and movement...

I'm curious if the way I handle horse movement is different from everyone else...

If a horse starts with both hexes adjacent to a megahex, how many moves does it take the horse to travel around the megahex and return to his starting hexes?

I count 12 moves. (6 if you replace the megahex with 1 hex)

Also, if you allow the horse to turn 360 degrees in-place by keeping its rear (or front) hex stationary, that also takes 6 moves.

All of this makes me wonder if we really need special rules to slow down a horse or restrict it's ability to turn.

Last edited by platimus; 10-12-2018 at 08:01 AM.
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Old 07-31-2018, 08:20 PM   #10
David Bofinger
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Sydney, Australia
Default Re: How do you all handle mounted combat?

I think you need to cover two basic cases:
  • Anything where the rider is basically attached to the animal at the hips. The main case is a horse, but it probably applies to camels, theropods, overgrown wolves, dragons and small elephants as well, and perhaps to canoes and boats with some adjustments. Rider and horse are one monster for movement purposes. Rider can't easily attack into front hexside unless he has a polearm, or something like that. Parthian shooting might be a talent?
  • Anything where the rider is standing on a platform and can turn if he wants: wagons, chariots, unreasonably large proboscideans with gigantic howdahs on their backs, ships, etc. The rider is standing in a hex that happens to move and can fight as if standing on terra firma. He might have some cover.
Any new case is shoehorned into one of these. In either case the rider is elevated and difficult to attack, relevant talents will prevent a penalty and the ridden creature might also be able to attack.
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