Enhanced Move, Slams, and Explosions

[johndallman]

Originally Posted by ErhnamDJ

So what would you have happen when she hits something while moving at these insane speeds?

I wouldn't be running or playing in this campaign. I can't take superhero games seriously.

Originally Posted by ErhnamDJ

But at that speed? It just doesn't seem right to me. I wouldn't put up any fight if that was the ruling. At least then I wouldn't have to worry about tripping on a rock and accidentally blowing up a city, so it would seem like an okay tradeoff. But it still doesn't feel right to me.

If you're going to decide this stuff on the basis of what "feels right", you need to have your GM and other players in broad agreement about how this stuff works, because you have no valid outside reference. Without agreement, you'll just fall into arguments. Our opinions don't mean much, because we don't know all the context.

[ErhnamDJ]

Originally Posted by johndallman

If you're going to decide this stuff on the basis of what "feels right", you need to have your GM and other players in broad agreement about how this stuff works, because you have no valid outside reference. Without agreement, you'll just fall into arguments. Our opinions don't mean much, because we don't know all the context.

Right. The issue that we've run into here is that I had assumed this worked one way, and the other players--and possibly the GM--assumed it worked a different way. It wouldn't have been an issue if this was dealt with in the rules. Then we would have had something to point to and say, "This is how high-speed collisions work." And then that could have been handled in character creation, maybe with some options somewhere.

But I took it for granted that there would be some speed that a character could move that would cause an explosion when they slammed into something. I know that there is such a thing as meteor strikes and kinetic bombardment, so I wasn't sure how to explain that in a different way from my character in game terms.

If I'm trying to make a character that is a meteor moving at whatever speed the Tunguska meteor (or comet or whatever it was) was moving, that will have the same results when it hits something, how do I stat that up?


And then there's the separate issue of how I could add the explosion modifier to this slam damage that I do have. I have no clue how to do that other than with imbuements, and imbuements don't seem right either, since I can't imagine any way that she could fail to explode when slamming into something.

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by ErhnamDJ

Is that always true? What's the fastest thing humans have ever put into space? Does that not explode if it hits something?

Things humans have put into space don't really have the mass x velocity to go BOOM when they re-enter, they just go BUST instead. That's why it's going to take 2 years just to put someone in Mars orbit :)

Natural bodies on the other hand, can be going so fast as to go BOOM. Big Enough Meteors (or comets) can be moving at Many times Earth's escape velocity, and can come in some really frightening sizes, which also helps make up for any deficit in velocity.

I recommend this post that originally came from the GURPSNet mailing list on kinetic kill weapons.

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by ErhnamDJ

And then there's the separate issue of how I could add the explosion modifier to this slam damage that I do have. I have no clue how to do that other than with imbuements, and imbuements don't seem right either, since I can't imagine any way that she could fail to explode when slamming into something.

I'd go with a variation on modifying regular ST-sourced damage, possibly at half cost because you can't use it with quite the same finesse.

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by ErhnamDJ

Also, how much damage is 1kT?

It's not linear.

1 kT = 33941d or 12d*2828.4-ish
17 kT = 576999d or 12d*48083.25

[Sunrunners_Fire]

Originally Posted by Bruno

It's not linear.

1 kT = 33941d or 12d*2828.4-ish
17 kT = 576999d or 12d*48083.25

It should be noted for the purposes of this conversation that Earth (as in the planet) has between 944,530,623 HP (if treated as Unliving) and 1,889,061,246 HP (if treated as Homogenous or Diffuse). (Roughly; if the numbers included in the "Earth Mass" article on Wikipedia are accurate anywise.)

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by ErhnamDJ

Right. The issue that we've run into here is that I had assumed this worked one way, and the other players--and possibly the GM--assumed it worked a different way.

Yeah you need to always ask about something like that.
When your building a character with some ideas you need to run those ideas by the GM to be sure he is ok with them and that your both on the same page.
There are no rules for a character doing this becasue it really just does not happen. The only genre where it is possible is the Supers and they dont work that way. You have some massive knock back or collision damage with minor fragmentation or rubble sometimes, most often you just have a regular impact.
The hulk or Superman may fly or be knocked into a building at high speed but then the building is just trashed and falls down with scattered debris.

Speedsters in a Supers RPG are often built by newbies with the intent of doing massive damage by running into things but the rules are usually you get what you pay for so there are heavy limits. However as I and others have said your also not getting a lot of the drawbacks either.

If you want to build an explosion power there are a couple of ways to go.
Innate Attack with explosion as an alternate of your Enhanced Move would be the simplest.
You can also use the rules from PU4 and apply explosion to the PCs enhanced movement based damage. However that will be a little more work and likely more expensive.

[johndallman]

Originally Posted by ErhnamDJ

But I took it for granted that there would be some speed that a character could move that would cause an explosion when they slammed into something. I know that there is such a thing as meteor strikes and kinetic bombardment, so I wasn't sure how to explain that in a different way from my character in game terms.

Well, GURPS allows you to describe all kinds of things that are physically impossible. Your character is an example. But this seems to be done by extrapolating the core of the system which deals with physically possible, human-scale PP, HS) things.

GURPS can have rules for PPHS events, because it's comparatively easy to find out what the answers should be, and then make gameable approximations. But rules for non-PP things are harder to make seem consistent - because they aren't consistent with PP things.

Please remember how many caveats I hung on that estimate of 17 kilotons. This is because it is not valid, because you can't actually move at 6.6 million mph on earth's surface according to physics, and a physics estimate is only valid in physically valid circumstances.

At this point GURPS falls back on the meta-rule that "You get what you bought", which does not provide you with an explosion because you didn't buy it. And if the GM wants to rule that you get no explosion, he's completely entitled to do so.

[ErhnamDJ]

Originally Posted by johndallman

At this point GURPS falls back on the meta-rule that "You get what you bought", which does not provide you with an explosion because you didn't buy it. And if the GM wants to rule that you get no explosion, he's completely entitled to do so.

How would you stat up the Tunguska meteor as a character?

If we can stat up other inanimate-objects-as-characters, we should be able to stat up meteors, right?

[johndallman]

Originally Posted by ErhnamDJ

How would you stat up the Tunguska meteor as a character?

It's a very boring character. No mind, no ability to move, no skills, nobody to make use of it. It spends a few billion years orbiting the sun - it has no ability to alter its trajectory - and then crashes. Dullsville.

If you want to play a sapient comet with some self-mobility, start by explaining how it works, and if I believe in that for the game I'm running, I'll try for some statistics.

To summarise "I wouldn't stat the Tunguska meteor as a character. What's possible is not the same thing as what's interesting."