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Old 03-22-2020, 08:14 PM   #1
thom
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Default Feudal Rank/Status and Cost of Living

For my upcoming fantasy game I've decided to go the route of including status and all it's niceties into Feudal Rank at 10 points/level. I also plan to use the "Cost of Living" rules which means that yes - the vast majority of the world (including the starting PCs) are technically considered as Feudal Rank 0 (Status 0) "yeomen/peasants" whose monthly Cost of Living (Col) will be $600. I'm OK with that.

What I'm working on is the Cost of Living for the various Feudal ranks, and I want to make sure I understand the "included Status at no extra cost" effect of higher ranks. Per B29 ranks 2 - 4 give +1 status, and ranks 5 -7 give +2 to to status. I'm thinking this means the following:

Feudal Rank 0 = $600/month Col
Feudal Rank 1 = $1,200/month Col
Feudal Rank 2 = $1,200/month Col (and not $3,000/month because of the +1 status effect)
Feudal Rank 3 = $3,000/month (instead of $12,000/month for the same reason)
Feudal Rank 4 = $12,000/month (instead of $60,000/month ditto)

Feudal Rank 5 = $12,000/month??
Here's where it gets tricky; since rank 5 gives +2 status, do I use the 5 - 2 = status 3 and so only charge $12,000/month instead of $600,000 for status 5?

I know both Bill Stoddard and Kromm have stated that the organization (in this case the feudal state) pays for the difference in lifestyle benefits when rank provides the extra status benefits. I just want to double-check that my numbers are correct. Thanks for any input!

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Old 03-22-2020, 08:45 PM   #2
Fred Brackin
 
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Default Re: Feudal Rank/Status and Cost of Living

Actually it's Rank that gives you the discount on CoL and not Status It'
s status that you have to pay the CoL to keep up..
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Old 03-23-2020, 08:09 AM   #3
Donny Brook
 
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Default Re: Feudal Rank/Status and Cost of Living

Feudal Rank is a broken concept. Heirarchy in a feudal society as a whole IS Social Status. But of course it's possible to have organizations within the society with an internal Rank structure.

However, if you insist on using Feudal Rank, it "replaces" social status, so the SS boost from higher ranks doesn't exist since there is no parallel structure for higher ranks to boost Status in.
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Old 03-23-2020, 09:35 AM   #4
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Default Re: Feudal Rank/Status and Cost of Living

Quote:
Originally Posted by Donny Brook View Post
Feudal Rank is a broken concept. Heirarchy in a feudal society as a whole IS Social Status. But of course it's possible to have organizations within the society with an internal Rank structure.

However, if you insist on using Feudal Rank, it "replaces" social status, so the SS boost from higher ranks doesn't exist since there is no parallel structure for higher ranks to boost Status in.
I think there is a parallel structure. A bishop or lord mayor can probably be considered to have moderate social status without having any feudal rank. Moreover, a miscellaneous unlanded son of nobility can have the social perquisites of status without having any retinue to command via feudal rank.
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Last edited by ravenfish; 03-23-2020 at 09:38 AM.
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Old 03-23-2020, 10:03 AM   #5
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Default Re: Feudal Rank/Status and Cost of Living

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Originally Posted by ravenfish View Post
I think there is a parallel structure. A bishop or lord mayor can probably be considered to have moderate social status without having any feudal rank. Moreover, a miscellaneous unlanded son of nobility can have the social perquisites of status without having any retinue to command via feudal rank.
In the case of bishops, it depends on their bishopric, I think: A bishop is a Prince of the Church, and in that era, might have a body of troops at his command.
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Old 03-23-2020, 11:05 AM   #6
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Default Re: Feudal Rank/Status and Cost of Living

Not specific to the original question, but I'd suggest keeping Feudal Rank and Status separate. I use Courtesy Rank (Feudal) for anyone not an officer of the crown or a landed noble (e.g. knights bachelor and their squires).
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Old 03-23-2020, 11:21 AM   #7
ravenfish
 
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Default Re: Feudal Rank/Status and Cost of Living

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Originally Posted by Prince Charon View Post
In the case of bishops, it depends on their bishopric, I think: A bishop is a Prince of the Church, and in that era, might have a body of troops at his command.
Yes, I agree that some bishops were sufficiently emeshed in the secular power structure to deserve feudal rank. I would probably limit this to the ones who had landholders owing loyalty to them in the feudal manner, though- simply having a few soldiers to deploy for keeping order would probably be a perquisite of other forms of rank, just as a modern CEO can order around some security guards without having Police Rank.
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Old 03-23-2020, 11:52 AM   #8
Donny Brook
 
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Default Re: Feudal Rank/Status and Cost of Living

Quote:
Originally Posted by ravenfish View Post
I think there is a parallel structure. A bishop or lord mayor can probably be considered to have moderate social status without having any feudal rank. Moreover, a miscellaneous unlanded son of nobility can have the social perquisites of status without having any retinue to command via feudal rank.
Chartered towns and the church are examples of what I meant by heirarchies within the society. But they are not parallel to the overall social structure of feudalism.
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Old 03-23-2020, 11:59 AM   #9
thom
 
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Default Re: Feudal Rank/Status and Cost of Living

::sigh::

Yes, I know "feudal rank is broken", and no I don't want to separate FR and Status. ::eyes roll:: All I want to know is if my calculation of the reduced cost the player has to pay for his Col is correct based on the rules. Sorry if I didn't make that clear enough.

And as the rules state (on B29),
"Alternatively, one form of Rank might replace Status...Each level of Rank gives all its usual benefits plus the effect of an equivalent level of Status."

I'm interpreting this to mean that the "equivalent level of Status" does involve a Cost of Living expense. Which is why I'm trying to figure out how much my players will have to pay by themselves at the higher FR levels.
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Old 03-23-2020, 12:15 PM   #10
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Default Re: Feudal Rank/Status and Cost of Living

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Originally Posted by thom View Post
I'm interpreting this to mean that the "equivalent level of Status" does involve a Cost of Living expense. Which is why I'm trying to figure out how much my players will have to pay by themselves at the higher FR levels.
Rank only grants a bonus to Status when Rank coexists with Status. When Rank replaces Status, which is what you're doing, there is no bonus. If you assume that this includes the Cost of Living table, then the cost of living is just the normal table, replacing Status with Rank.

(Feudal Rank is not at all realistic. Feudalism doesn't operate as an organization with a hierarchical structure. There is a hierarchy, but it's ad-hoc, transient, and not a simple tree.)
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