Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > The Fantasy Trip

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-29-2020, 10:15 AM   #1
hcobb
 
hcobb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Pacheco, California
Default Blur Ring costs less than a Blur Spell

Blur(T): Costs 500 XP and 1 ST per turn used.

Blur Ring: Costs $3000 (or 300 XP) and no ST to use.

So play it smart and don't learn the Blur spell.
__________________
-HJC
hcobb is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-29-2020, 02:09 PM   #2
larsdangly
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Default Re: Blur Ring costs less than a Blur Spell

Or, you could say the Blur ring 'costs' an IQ of 18, the Create Lesser Magic Item spell, and your own magical laboratory and bevy of apprentices. So maybe go ahead and get that spell if you don't think are up for the investment required to make the item.
larsdangly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-29-2020, 03:01 PM   #3
Skarg
 
Join Date: May 2015
Default Re: Blur Ring costs less than a Blur Spell

This is low down on my nearly-endless unwritten list of reasons why I would almost never play with XP exchangeable for money.

It's also on my list of reasons I don't have trivially-available magic items for sale (and when a good magic item is for sale, it's probably not at list price).
Skarg is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-29-2020, 03:13 PM   #4
Celjabba
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Luxembourg
Default Re: Blur Ring costs less than a Blur Spell

As always, "assuming it can be purchased".

Also, the spell make it far easier to give blur to someone else mid-fight.

A solo wizard (with a couple apprentices and a few red shirts with crossbow in front plus a physicker close by, of course !) will likely prefer the ring.
A wizard who work with a team will likely find a use for the spell.

Last edited by Celjabba; 06-29-2020 at 03:47 PM.
Celjabba is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-29-2020, 04:26 PM   #5
Steve Plambeck
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Default Re: Blur Ring costs less than a Blur Spell

Agreeing fully with Skarg's two reasons, I'd also like to sing the refrain I've used in other threads related to magic item costs.

If using the costs in the tables, best to take those as the costs or values for the UN-powered versions of the items. Semi-powered versions should cost at least 10 times more, and fully powered versions 100 times more. Again, that's only if you allow PCs to shop from the table, which I would never do.

That would bring the cost/value of Henry's Blur Ring up to $300,000. And it should be the sort of toy only the emperor of the known world can afford.
__________________
"I'm not arguing. I'm just explaining why I'm right." - Monty Python

Last edited by Steve Plambeck; 07-03-2020 at 03:13 AM.
Steve Plambeck is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-29-2020, 05:44 PM   #6
larsdangly
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Default Re: Blur Ring costs less than a Blur Spell

We need to come up with a numbering or naming scheme for our debates so we can cut to the chase more easily. I feel like we always have several open threads at any given moment that involve a certain distinguished member proposing a white-room argument involving magic item purchases, followed by several dozen responses to the effect that no one really plays like that.
larsdangly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2020, 07:28 PM   #7
Anaraxes
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Default Re: Blur Ring costs less than a Blur Spell

You can cast the Blur spell more than once.
Anaraxes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2020, 01:04 PM   #8
Axly Suregrip
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Default Re: Blur Ring costs less than a Blur Spell

I believe Henry's point is that the Lesser and Greater magic items' (and this one in particular) standard prices are grossly too low.

And yes, they are.
Axly Suregrip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2020, 02:31 PM   #9
Skarg
 
Join Date: May 2015
Default Re: Blur Ring costs less than a Blur Spell

Taking Lars' suggestion of just listing the relevant known issues this brings up:

Blur(T): Costs 500 XP and 1 ST per turn used.
#XPCostsToLearnSpellsAndTalentsIsHighForLowAttribu teCharacters
#OriginalITLLetYouLearnUpToYourIQWithoutXP

Blur Ring: Costs $3000 (or 300 XP) and no ST to use.
#MaybeMagicItemsShouldAllCostFatigueToUse
#ConvertingXPToGoldIsWeird
#GMsMightNotWantToMakeMagicItemsEasilyBuyable
#MagicItemsListPricesAreLow
#SomeMagicItemListPricesAreGreatBargains

So play it smart and don't learn the Blur spell.
#IgnoreTheIssuesAndThereWillBeGameyWeirdness
Skarg is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-03-2020, 03:59 AM   #10
Steve Plambeck
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Default Re: Blur Ring costs less than a Blur Spell

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skarg View Post
#IgnoreTheIssuesAndThereWillBeGameyWeirdness
Well, exactly. And the threads Henry starts like this one are absolutely great for uncovering these issues, issues that when left hidden do (for some of us) "gnaw at the heart" of the game -- if that's not too overly-dramatic a way of putting it :)

$3000 to save a wizard tying up one point of memory sounds like quite a good deal to me, without including the big freebie of running the spell ST free too. And if it's for a non-wizard to be able to use the spell without tying up 3 talent points worth of memory? If that isn't a huge bargain, even for a totally unpowered item, I don't know what is!

One little concession I might make for these much-too-inexpensive magic items is to allow the owner to turn it on and start continuing spells for free, but every turn thereafter they would have to pay the regular cost. For Blur that would only save the user 1 ST on turn 1. It's a cheap IQ 8 spell anyway. If the item's spell was Summon Bear, that would save that initial 4 ST on turn 1, but then cost the 1 ST per turn normally required to continue that spell. That seems to me to be a whopping, big, generous enough ST savings right there. I feel any of these items from the official table have such ridiculously low prices they shouldn't be any easier to use than that.

I'm not adverse to considerably more expensive magic items running as self-powered or semi-powered, and certainly NPCs might own such a prize when it fits the story. But if a cash value is to be assigned to those items, it ought to be pretty astronomical.
__________________
"I'm not arguing. I'm just explaining why I'm right." - Monty Python

Last edited by Steve Plambeck; 07-03-2020 at 04:05 AM.
Steve Plambeck is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:38 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.