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Old 05-03-2019, 11:17 AM   #101
KevinJ
 
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Default Re: Fantasy Trip Illusions

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Originally Posted by JLV View Post
Have the GM roll against the viewer's IQ then, to determine if he notices those minor things, if it's truly important. Problem solved.
When you are being charged by the rhinoceros, do you consider if the grass it charged from moved according to your knowledge of how grass should move when a rhinoceros charges through it OR do you get the hell out of the way?

In combat, your opponents probably aren't paying attention to those very insignificant things. Insignificant compared to a battleaxe speeding towards you head, anyway.

In a non-combat situation the viewers might have time to notice inconsistencies, but not when most illusions are being used.
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Old 05-03-2019, 04:44 PM   #102
JLV
 
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Default Re: Fantasy Trip Illusions

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When you are being charged by the rhinoceros, do you consider if the grass it charged from moved according to your knowledge of how grass should move when a rhinoceros charges through it OR do you get the hell out of the way?
Wait. What? You're now going to argue about "realism" in a discussion of disbelieving magical illusions? Besides, don't you think that part of the training in the "dsibelief cantrip" might include recognizing signs that something isn't real in a split second -- the same way that a soldier notices something that makes him immediately drop to the ground without being able to explicitly tell you what that thing is?

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Originally Posted by KevinJ View Post
In combat, your opponents probably aren't paying attention to those very insignificant things. Insignificant compared to a battleaxe speeding towards you head, anyway.

In a non-combat situation the viewers might have time to notice inconsistencies, but not when most illusions are being used.
I'll disagree completely with you on that -- a rookie might not notice those things right off the bat, but a veteran sure would -- I've seen it a million times. That's why he (or she, I would presume) has made it to the point where they ARE a veteran. He might not be able to DO anything about it just then, but he NOTICED it all right. Just sayin'...
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Old 05-03-2019, 06:12 PM   #103
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Default Re: Fantasy Trip Illusions

Illusions are common enough that attempting to Disbelieve them merits its own entry in the Options list. So even if common folk don't regularly deal with them, evidently Adventurers encounter them fairly often. And that means they should also know HOW to look for those telltale signs.

The question is simply whether they DO.

So if the Player announces "I'm going to watch for signs that this dude might be an Illusion", and then later attempts to Disbelieve, the GM should award some bonus on the roll. But if the Player just attempts it cold, without any prior announcement of watching for clues, then no bonus.
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Old 05-03-2019, 08:28 PM   #104
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Default Re: Fantasy Trip Illusions

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So if the Player announces "I'm going to watch for signs that this dude might be an Illusion", and then later attempts to Disbelieve, the GM should award some bonus on the roll. But if the Player just attempts it cold, without any prior announcement of watching for clues, then no bonus.
Apply "Waiting for an Opening" -ITL 127, but with an IQ instead of DX bonus?
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Old 05-03-2019, 09:00 PM   #105
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Default Re: Fantasy Trip Illusions

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Apply "Waiting for an Opening" -ITL 127, but with an IQ instead of DX bonus?
That seems fair enough. Except in this case, perhaps you'd call it "Becoming Skeptical".
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Old 05-03-2019, 09:17 PM   #106
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Default Re: Fantasy Trip Illusions

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That seems fair enough. Except in this case, perhaps you'd call it "Becoming Skeptical".
Do you get bonus XPs if you use Dagger Mastery to defend against the illusion princess whose face is twisted into a mask of hatred as she stabs at you with a dagger dripping with poison while you direct Staff V blasts from your silver dagger at the rival wizard standing behind her as you wait for an opening to disbelieve?

You can tell that it must be an illusion because no drops of poison actually discolor the filthy dungeon floor under her feet.
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Old 05-03-2019, 11:28 PM   #107
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Default Re: Fantasy Trip Illusions

As I understand it, XP is almost entirely up to the GM nowadays.

And as previously established, if you're defending, then you're not Disbelieving (and therefore also not Becoming Skeptical).

But more importantly, do you really think that the only time anybody might ever need to Disbelieve an Illusion is right in the middle of combat? Do your games consist entirely of battle, and no other kind of interaction with NPCs?

Mine don't, and there are all kinds of abilities that would be useless in combat, but are immensely helpful in other scenarios.
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