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Old 01-22-2020, 05:47 AM   #1
Dalai Rasta
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Default Cursed Items and Disadvantages

How would I build a cursed magic item that imposed a disadvantage? The item in this case is not removable, even by a remove curse spell; however, the disadvantage can be bought down by acclimation to the object's effects.

Last edited by Dalai Rasta; 01-22-2020 at 05:49 AM. Reason: expanding on question
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Old 01-22-2020, 06:20 AM   #2
coronatiger
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
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Default Re: Cursed Items and Disadvantages

If the only way to get rid of the disadvantage is to pay character points, the cursed item itself is only there for flavor. In that case, I'd suggest you treat the curse as an ordinary disad.
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Old 01-22-2020, 03:51 PM   #3
bocephus
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Default Re: Cursed Items and Disadvantages

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalai Rasta View Post
How would I build a cursed magic item that imposed a disadvantage? The item in this case is not removable, even by a remove curse spell; however, the disadvantage can be bought down by acclimation to the object's effects.
Im not sure what you mean by build. I feel like your asking a how do I as a GM implement this, not what are the stats of a cursed item. Is it your intention that this "Curse" is something special so it doesnt follow normal rules?

Does it have some positive effect that makes it worth having so you are trying to figure out the cost minus the "value" of the curse?

Is it something as simple as "You put the ring on and feel an intense pain as you have visions of a roiling mass of inky tentacles festooned with lizard like eyes. You feel as though your head is going to explode. Give me your character sheet" You write on it -Xpt disadvantage fear of the dark CRXX. Taking the ring off doesnt do anything (only going to a priest of Blah Blah and having them remove the Cursed Eye of the Elder God from you will get rid of the curse, but you be left with a permanent quirk of seeing tiny floating eyes in the dark when you are alone CRX). Thats one way I do it.

Or does a PC want to make one? So you actually need a mechanic for them... In which case I dont have any advice for you (Im not the guru that a lot of the others here are with the mechanics).

If its an item with a purely negative effect then just make it up, it has no value except maybe material cost. So its just a GM tool for advancing the story, creating tension, or pushing a PC to explore a different recipe for interactions.

Figure out what you want it to do, how you want it to appear to the PC, have some thoughts already about how to lift the curse if it can be lifted, and probably some ideas on how the PCs can get that information. Do you want it to come on all at once, or grow incrementally, does it get worse based on some trigger the PC doesnt know. Does the PC even know theres a curse on them. Does it follow the item (take it off and it stops), does the curse on the item reload (can the same item effect more than one person), is not being able to remove the item part of the curse. If the PC pays the point cost of the disad, and later can remove the item do they get a point refund or maybe a corresponding advantage?

I will assume that the PCs have been made aware that cursed things are in your world. I tend to make the "cant remove the item till you break the curse" smaller/less character altering curses, you have the visual of the item and can target something to try and get rid of it. More powerful curses sink into the being and the item becomes inert or can just go on cursing people but the item itself is just the channel for the curse, not the curse itself.

Is this a punishment? Are you seeking to correct a PC behavior?

Theres so many possibile answers to your question, your going to have to help narrow the scope of what you need by giving more info. What is the item, what is the curse, why would the PC keep it and buy it down with points rather than stop everything and try to get it removed,
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Old 01-22-2020, 04:49 PM   #4
Dalai Rasta
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Default Re: Cursed Items and Disadvantages

In this case, the item is a ring; I haven't decided on the particular disadvantage that goes with it yet. It was created in a previous age of magic, and ordinary means won't remove it; it would require research and some sort of quest for removal. I could simply impose a disadvantage on the character, and simply condition removal on completion of the required actions, in which case the ring is just a cosmetic effect; however, even if the ring is removed, the ring will retain its power.
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Old 01-23-2020, 02:35 AM   #5
Michele
 
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Default Re: Cursed Items and Disadvantages

Quote:
Originally Posted by coronatiger View Post
If the only way to get rid of the disadvantage is to pay character points, the cursed item itself is only there for flavor. In that case, I'd suggest you treat the curse as an ordinary disad.
I second this. The only question is whether the obvious, gory alternative (Missing Digit!) won't work either. After all, you aren't removing the ring if you choose that alternative.
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Old 01-23-2020, 03:54 AM   #6
bocephus
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Default Re: Cursed Items and Disadvantages

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalai Rasta View Post
In this case, the item is a ring; I haven't decided on the particular disadvantage that goes with it yet. It was created in a previous age of magic, and ordinary means won't remove it; it would require research and some sort of quest for removal. I could simply impose a disadvantage on the character, and simply condition removal on completion of the required actions, in which case the ring is just a cosmetic effect; however, even if the ring is removed, the ring will retain its power.
This is my thoughts based on how I use curses on my table.

Do what you want for how it works, if you want it to be able to be bought down over time then give some thought to what disadvantage it might be so it makes sense that the PC can "overcome" it by working at it. I dont favor the "buy it down without removing it" unless its changing the PCs body.

My personal feeling is that unless its a stat or skill disad (minor curse as these things go) there is no option to overcome it except by removing the curse, it is a curse after all and not much of one if you can just learn to live with it. If you go that route I feel like removing the curse should then have the bonus of retaining the earned points at the new level so no CharPts are lost (I am somewhat stingy with CP and play lower point campaigns, 150ish starting, so thats a mega punishment to impose on my PCs).

The bigger the curse the more purposeful it was, someone invested time and resources into making this thing for a reason. Once you understand the reason, the mechanics of what the curse does become fairly simple. Also the curse doesn't have to be fully relevant, the cult of Dagon the Unblinking hasn't existed for centuries so fealty to them wouldn't do much, but it might spur the PC to resurrect the cult. Extreme Aversion to Obsidian isn't a big deal cause its no longer the main weapon material 1000yrs later. Big curses that have been laying around for millennia aren't necessarily up to date hehheh.

I would be careful to introduce some lore, at least a small bit, about the existence of such "powerful curses" from the earlier age. Perhaps by finding a mural, tapestry, story, journal, legend about a hero that had to undertake a quest for some unknown reason (unless you want to really spoon feed it to the players). Hint about the cure but not the cause. The mural depicts the hero fighting something where you can see what might be the ring, later in the story Hero is holding the chalice of blah blah and you can plainly see no ring. or some such thing. Perhaps the hero specifically wanted it buried with them to prevent others from being affected, that's why its here and protected.

As for the mechanics of Curse itself, telling the PC that not only can you not remove it, you don't even have a desire to remove it is the start. Once the curse is imposed/known I would probably just say give me your char sheet and write it on it or give them a slip of paper with the new modified stats/disads. At least the things that they will need to know to play it, keeping it secret and modifying successes and failures yourself is a lot of keeping track of stuff, I dont do this long term its too much work for me.

Add a PC mechanic for removal/discovery, for good RPers I will give them the Meta info and just let them handle the mechanics. If you want to introduce it slowly and your the only one at the table that knows do yourself a favor and write it out so you dont have to think too much about it.

Here's a possible mechanic off the cuff:
Each morning the PC is allowed to roll a will/IQ/lore/religion/history/something that makes sense in your world. A roll of X or less is a success for that day and the PC or group of PCs awakes having had an odd dream/vision/insight. A successful roll gives 1 of 3-6 hints about what it is and how to remove it (you keep the hints). Once they have all of the hints the PC(s) are fully aware of the curse and can now pursue removing it by researching it directly. Until the PC is fully aware of it the PC just treats it as a piece of jewelry that they wish to keep (you could slap a small Delusion on it that the PC feels its somehow important but doesn't want to reveal it for fear of someone taking it).
Is the PC able to reveal the hints to others as they happen, do they realize they are hints to start? Maybe the curse doesn't actually hit till the hints are all given, so awareness AND the impact hit in the same moment, is there a chance to dodge the curse with some impressive success? Realization that this is about to happen just before it happens, maybe the others realize it and have to try to convince the PC that its true vs the delusion that item is good for the PC.

You can stretch this out by or compress it by having the degree of success really hard like hard 5-6 or less or really easy 12 or less modified by some skill/attribute if you like. Further you can stretch it by having the hints be random so sometimes they repeat, maybe each success means that hint keeps repeating till the next success. These two things can be combined in a couple ways to allow you to meter out the hints at the rate you want while still giving the PC some feeling of control in a Meta way.

Once they are aware of the curse drop the concealment delusion off the char sheet or change it to resentment of the other PCs or something. Though the other PCs may not believe it right away without some sort of proof, especially if the PC has only been acting a little off.

Depending on the source of the curse and the reason it was created you might combine several disads to get the desired affect.
  • Was it a curse from a smarter weaker race against a barbarian king... that could target ST/DX and combat/physical disadvantages
  • Was it a curse from a primitive shaman against more advanced invaders it might target HT emotions/fear/greed/trust to warp the target into leaving
  • It could be trying to physically turn the PC into a creature/servant and the first manifestation is the not visible stuff
  • Was it from a cleric that sought to bring down the Mage lord then IQ/Will/Spells/Magery/memory
  • Was it intended to subvert someone and make them embarrass themselves then Will and gluttony/carousing/brash/greed/lecherousness/uncontrolled hair growth/animal behaviors .

It can also be interesting when the "wrong PC" gets the curse. The Barbarian that gets the Mage kings curse becomes a really stupid but still very effective fighter, maybe more blood thirsty or prone to rage but its not such a big deal. The wizard getting the barbarian kings curse is ultra weak but still effective at spells and takes longer to react. The options are limitless. As the GM I like to add some random in the world that even Im not controlling, makes the story more fun.
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Old 01-23-2020, 06:50 AM   #7
bocephus
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Default Re: Cursed Items and Disadvantages

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michele View Post
I second this. The only question is whether the obvious, gory alternative (Missing Digit!) won't work either. After all, you aren't removing the ring if you choose that alternative.
It is for exactly this reason I wouldn't use a ring/weapon for a major plot hook Curse that falls into the other worldly variety unless there is a non curse related reason to keep it (the wearer of the ring is exempt from taxes or something rather useful).

Bracelet/Bracer/boots maybe, necklace/crown more likely ... at least a whole hand, arm, foot, leg has to be a risk if its an option at all.

Many PC types would be perfectly ok with hacking off a finger to avoid a big curse and as a GM I wouldn't find that out of character. In fact most ring fingers are something you can live remarkably well without.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalai Rasta View Post
In this case, the item is a ring; I haven't decided on the particular disadvantage that goes with it yet. It was created in a previous age of magic, and ordinary means won't remove it; it would require research and some sort of quest for removal. I could simply impose a disadvantage on the character, and simply condition removal on completion of the required actions, in which case the ring is just a cosmetic effect; however, even if the ring is removed, the ring will retain its power.
This really should have been my first response, this is what happens when you take time to walk away from what your writing and come back to it. I tend to default to the Roleplay aspects and didnt answer the question you asked. Im not going to delete my earlier post because I still feel like its good info but I think this is better.

Is there a special reason you cant just use a "Divine Curse" B132 RAW? It sounds like that's exactly what your talking about and it is remarkable flexible. It doesn't have to be "Divinity based" just a powerful magic that doesn't follow the regular rules of the world the PCs know.

You have to mechanically address the Meta details. At your table can your players separate info from their characters. Is the player/char aware of the curse. Is the player/char aware of the disadvantage. Is the PC aware that there might be a cure. Is there a reason the PC would put it on. Is there an intended target of the curse. Is it possible the wrong person gets it.

If its simple cause effect > I put the ring on; I feel weak; I attempt to remove the ring; I cant remove the ring; Im cursed ... add the disadvantage to the PC sheet and move on.

If your trying to build drama/tension then your going to have to mask the cause better and maybe lead into the effect slowly > I put the ring on; I feel vigorous; a week later I begin to feel weak and I cant sleep; what is causing this; I start having strange dreams; at some point I attempt to remove the ring and cant; am I cursed?; yes Im cursed (add the disad to the PC sheet); how do I remove the curse (start researching the quest)

The most complicated part of the mechanics IMO is how are you going to implement it. Are you going to just put it on the char sheet and make the player track it, or are you going to try and remember to subtract it on the sly when its appropriate and keep the player in the dark.
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Old 01-25-2020, 12:03 PM   #8
Dalai Rasta
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Default Re: Cursed Items and Disadvantages

In game, I had seeded the idea of cursed items from a previous age of magic that would be very difficult to remove, intending it to be used to introduce a sympathetic villain that the players could help break the curse. Canonically, they were created by a demon lord as a means of controlling his servants and forcing them into darker and darker actions.

Out of game, one of my players sent me an email requesting that she be given one of these items as a challenge! So we've been working together to develop the curse she would have to deal with; we've settled on a set of disadvantages that work together to make the ring have serious effects on her character's behavior. She has also requested a small out, in that she would be able to mitigate some of the effects, either through buying the disadvantages down slightly or using character points to occasionally buy successful self-control rolls. Since she's taking a voluntary set of disadvantages for an indeterminate period of time, I'm allowing her some leeway in how she deals with it, and have promised her some special benefits when she finally overcomes the curse.
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Old 02-03-2020, 11:00 AM   #9
Dalai Rasta
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Default Re: Cursed Items and Disadvantages

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalai Rasta View Post
She has also requested a small out, in that she would be able to mitigate some of the effects, either through buying the disadvantages down slightly or using character points to occasionally buy successful self-control rolls. Since she's taking a voluntary set of disadvantages for an indeterminate period of time, I'm allowing her some leeway in how she deals with it, and have promised her some special benefits when she finally overcomes the curse.
For anyone who's interested, we've settled on buying success rather than buying down the disadvantages. As for a reward, I'm tracking her points spent on successes against the points the other players spend, and banking the excess for her to use on improving her character's Will only.
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