The Future of the DFRPG

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by SilvercatMoonpaw

And if you already had enemy and treasure stat blocks you could probably just find one online.

*cough* Zuljita and I kinda beat SJG to this. The project is called Dungeons on Automatic and the dungeon generator is available for download. It does not require the installation of special software, and is operating-system independent - it requires a browser that supports reasonably modern Javascript.

[Kalzazz]

I think You All Meet at an Inn is, if not the perfect adventure, far and away the closest to a perfect adventure I've ever seen published

If more adventures of that awesome level were to be created I'd buy them

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by lordabdul

.

That doesn't seem correct to me. I won't claim to know much about the publishing world, but I do know there is precedent for writers specifically hired to do something on spec and then producing award-winning material.

Sure, but see the reply by Turhens Bay. Several authors have indicated no desire, sure they may change their mind if they are paid enough but that adds risk to the GURPS line. SJG has survived longer than almost any other RPG company by managing its risks well.
Also good points on the settings.
Tomb of Horrors, even the Underdark series were pretty setting agnostic.

Originally Posted by Gollum

I'm not a big fan of fantasy adventures. But I will buy DFRPG as soon as it will be developped enough.

That line of thought discourages more DFRPG material.
A company cant survive on future potential profits, it needs to pay the current bills with current profits or take on debt and hope they can get out of it later.
If people buy say Caverntown, Mirror of the Fire Demon, or any other adventure it encourages SJG and authors to make more. If they dont see sales it tells them not to bother.

[evileeyore]

I don't normally weigh into these... because as far as I'm concerned DFRPG doesn't need a setting. It could use some more adventures, but I'm not gonna cry if they never show up.

I almost never use prepublished settings, and while I do mine adventures, I also never use them as written.

And lastly... there is a whole entire 50 years worth of adventures already written for D&D, when necessary I just grab those and convert on the fly.

[ericbsmith]

Originally Posted by Bruno

*cough* Zuljita and I kinda beat SJG to this. The project is called Dungeons on Automatic and the dungeon generator is available for download. It does not require the installation of special software, and is operating-system independent - it requires a browser that supports reasonably modern Javascript.

I'd known about the DonJon Random Dungeon Generator, and have had it bookmarked for a long time. I didn't know about your project, and it looks amazing. Especially with the DF rules tie-ins and the Treasure Generator too. Is there a reason you don't have this live-hosted on a website people can just use without needing to download?

[scc]

Originally Posted by evileeyore

I don't normally weigh into these... because as far as I'm concerned DFRPG doesn't need a setting. It could use some more adventures, but I'm not gonna cry if they never show up.

I almost never use prepublished settings, and while I do mine adventures, I also never use them as written.

And lastly... there is a whole entire 50 years worth of adventures already written for D&D, when necessary I just grab those and convert on the fly.

DF could very well do with some more setting. Say you decide that the boss at the bottom of their first dungeon is an evil cleric questions that spring to mind that need immediate answers are:

1) What God does he worship? Apart from detailing the villain it
2) Gives both you and the players a starting point for what he might have at his disposal. Having a splatbook allows you to pull a fast one on your players and have their guess be wrong.
3) What support of support is he likely to have? Does his religion have good relations with any of the styles in Dungeon Magic?
4) How are the authorities going to react to the PCs actions? Will the king reward for handling this threat or will he simply tax their loot or even want them dead?

And these are just those that need to answered during the course of the adventure, after it you need to answer:

5) Will his church/god be upset at his death and seek to punish the PCs?
6) Will any churches/gods seek to reward the PCs?
6a) If his church/god is seeking the PCs harm, will another church/god seek to help or warn them?
7) If a god is helping them in 6a, how does the gods church feel about this?

All question that need answers and that a proper setting can help you answer.

[lordabdul]

Originally Posted by Turhan's Bey Company

These aren't wrong so far as they go, but they are incomplete.

Thanks Matt! That's very interesting.

[evileeyore]

Originally Posted by scc

All question that need answers and that a proper setting can help you answer.

All things I can confidently answer without a setting.

In fact... off the top of my head:

1) What God does he worship?

Aestus, the God of Mechnisms, Fire, Book Burning, and Criminal Overindulgence of Negative Emotions.

He isn't capital 'e' evil... he isn't even 'evil' at all*. He just has no self-control, so when he get's out of his forge-prison mountain, he tends to party hard and leave a bunch of victims in his wake. Or take up old petty fueds and start tossing around automaton-like war machines. Or just the old 'atomic wedgie-bot' for hi-jinks.


* None of the gods are Evil or Good in my games. They are more like petty, bickering frat-boys and sorority sisters, full up with their pride, self-importance, and wanton indulgences.

But some do decide to take on important 'causes' and then, whoa, watch out. Nothing like a God with a passion on for stopping forest fires or or ending world hunger or saving the strays. Or smiting all the Elves for being so pretty. 'Good' and 'Evil' are 'human' inventions to ascribe more sane angles to the Deities, so any of them that are good for society are "good' and those that are bad are "evil".

2) Gives both you and the players a starting point for what he might have at his disposal. Having a splatbook allows you to pull a fast one on your players and have their guess be wrong.

I can pull fast ones much easier when I'm not drawing from *books.

3) What support of support is he likely to have?

A few neophyte priests he hasn't managed to drive off. Like a 'Sith' lord he's culling the weakness from his apprentices. Like proper evil apprentices, they are waiting for their moment to topple him from his throne and crush all he desires as they rise above him.

Also a smattering of 'monsters' he's either summoned, conjured, or paid to guard various areas of his 'dungeon'. Some things just moved in and he hasn't driven them out like the Evil Eyes in the 'old kitchens' in the east wing.

Does his religion have good relations with any of the styles in Dungeon Magic?

I don't use those... so... not applicable.

4) How are the authorities going to react to the PCs actions? Will the king reward for handling this threat or will he simply tax their loot or even want them dead?

Town doesn't care. He's far enough away that his shenanigans haven't impacted them negatively. But on a really good social networking roll (Carousing, Current Affairs, or Propaganda at -5) they learn of a merchant family that has been raided several times by this villain and they are offering a reward of $1K for the Cleric and $500 for each of his apprentices. On a crit it's doubled.

5) Will his church/god be upset at his death and seek to punish the PCs?

Aestus has no legal Church in the lands of the Good, however there may be a few craftsmen (of the clockwork variety) who take umbrage and raise rates on the adventurers. Unofficially of course. Aestian priests are a jealous and solitary lot, so no, no one is seeking vengeance.

6) Will any churches/gods seek to reward the PCs?

Traveling priests of the Wandering God may show up and offer their services to the heroes as they leave or return to town on a roll of 5 of less until they have shown up 1d times or you roll an 18 (Aestus once burned the Wandering God until his screaming stopped for attempting to pilfer from his forge. The Wanderer got... better, but never forgave the machinist this slight). On a theology roll at -2 characters can learn that they can seek out the Church of Atherva and each receive a single free service (Atherva is a War Godess that Aestus attempted to criminally impact with his negative passions. They are not so much with the healing, but they have buffs and blessings and decursing).

6a) If his church/god is seeking the PCs harm, will another church/god seek to help or warn them?

Not likely as there is no church and Aestus cares not for his followers. They live or die on their own while he remains in his fiery mountain working his forge and passions.

However should the PCs somehow manage to anger Aestus, the Forge Lord may send a few automatons their way (they will show up in place of some other wandering damage). Or a group of Gnomish artificers with traps and poisoned crossbows. Really the same thing in the end. If this occurs... well. Some gods might help, if there is a PC Cleric or Holy Warrior check his God's reaction. If they have a Druid on a Very Good reaction roll either the Red Beast (The Beast That is Red of Tooth and Claw), The Lord and Lady of Leaves, or the Green Singer (aka Yhdra the Creator, The Dream-Witch, The Sower, She Who Sings With a Thousand Voices, etc) will aid the PCs.

But really aid from any one of those three is probably worse than whatever Aestus might throw at them. At least Aestus is relatively sane... those three things are Elder.

7) If a god is helping them in 6a, how does the gods church feel about this?

As first paragraph above.


I mean don't get me wrong. I love to do this. All day I can do this. And I do understand not everyone can just rattle of nonsense like this and then remember it with ease. (i just hate writing or I'd put my world book out there to flounder and die amongst the myriad of offerings)

But... GURPS has a long history of not making cohesive multi-book, in depth, market flooding, world settings. So looking to SJGames for a setting with the breadth and depth and kitchen-sinking of Golarion or the length of history of Mystara? Not going to happen.

[maximara]

Originally Posted by scc

DF could very well do with some more setting. Say you decide that the boss at the bottom of their first dungeon is an evil cleric questions that spring to mind that need immediate answers are:

1) What God does he worship? Apart from detailing the villain it
2) Gives both you and the players a starting point for what he might have at his disposal. Having a splatbook allows you to pull a fast one on your players and have their guess be wrong.
3) What support of support is he likely to have? Does his religion have good relations with any of the styles in Dungeon Magic?
4) How are the authorities going to react to the PCs actions? Will the king reward for handling this threat or will he simply tax their loot or even want them dead?

And these are just those that need to answered during the course of the adventure, after it you need to answer:

5) Will his church/god be upset at his death and seek to punish the PCs?
6) Will any churches/gods seek to reward the PCs?
6a) If his church/god is seeking the PCs harm, will another church/god seek to help or warn them?
7) If a god is helping them in 6a, how does the gods church feel about this?

All question that need answers and that a proper setting can help you answer.

Interestingly the D&D adventures during the TSR tended to be vague on such details so even though many were stated to be on Greyhawk nothing of that setting was needed to play them.

WotC adventures tended to be more generic. Of the 31 adventures only 5 were set on Eberron, 3 were on Greyhawk, and 1 in Revenloft. The rest were generic settings.

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by maximara

WotC adventures tended to be more generic. Of the 31 adventures only 5 were set on Eberron, 3 were on Greyhawk, and 1 in Revenloft. The rest were generic settings.

Not so generic, the Points of Light setting is an explicit one, and includes things like everything in the Nentir Vale, Thunderspire Labyrinth, the Tomb of Horrors adventure, and so forth. It's much more concrete than DF (it has maps!) but it doesn't actually have its own setting books, unlike Eberron, Greyhawk, et al. It did start out vague, but it became more concrete over time.