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Old 10-05-2020, 09:13 PM   #41
kirbwarrior
 
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Default Re: The Beauty of GURPS

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Originally Posted by sgtcallistan View Post
The simplicity of mechanics, frex where it's clear that more than 14 in a skill is usually wasting points (amazingly useful with almost all players).
14 is usually a minimum score for me and my players. Anything less requires a good reason.
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While I do not think that GURPS is perfect I do think that it is more balanced than what I am likely to create by GM fiat.
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Old 10-06-2020, 03:36 AM   #42
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Default Re: The Beauty of GURPS

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Originally Posted by sgtcallistan View Post
The simplicity of mechanics, frex where it's clear that more than 14 in a skill is usually wasting points (amazingly useful with almost all players).
"Usually" is an important qualification, though, and depends on many things. If you're betting your life on contests of Stealth against guards' Perception, 14 is not enough for a solo infiltrator.
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Old 10-06-2020, 04:12 AM   #43
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Default Re: The Beauty of GURPS

My players seem to have decided that skill-12 is acceptable - as your default in a skill you've never run into before.
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Old 10-06-2020, 06:43 AM   #44
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Default Re: The Beauty of GURPS

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Originally Posted by johndallman View Post
"Usually" is an important qualification, though, and depends on many things. If you're betting your life on contests of Stealth against guards' Perception, 14 is not enough for a solo infiltrator.
Stealth is probably one of the cheaper skills to boost. You can get Stealth-20 easily through taking DX 12, Craftiness 4, and Stalker 4, and spending 2 CP, for a total of 82 CP. Of course, players often think that you are cheating when you give their opponents Stealth-20 (especially if you give them Camouflage-20 as well).
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Old 10-06-2020, 10:31 AM   #45
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Default Re: The Beauty of GURPS

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Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl View Post
Stealth is probably one of the cheaper skills to boost. You can get Stealth-20 easily through taking DX 12, Craftiness 4, and Stalker 4, and spending 2 CP, for a total of 82 CP. Of course, players often think that you are cheating when you give their opponents Stealth-20 (especially if you give them Camouflage-20 as well).
Or, assuming DX 10, just spend the 40 pts to get it to 20.
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Old 10-06-2020, 11:00 AM   #46
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Default Re: The Beauty of GURPS

I frequently ignore capping talents at 4 levels. Especially IQ-based talents for characters whose concept includes being technically awesome but socially awkward.
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Old 10-06-2020, 11:52 AM   #47
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Default Re: The Beauty of GURPS

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
This is a point where the mechanics might not be as clear as you think. Skill-14 critically succeeds 2% of the time and critically fails 2% of the time. Skill-16 critically succeeds 10% of the time and critically fails 1/2 of 1% of the time.
I often like to get my PC's primary adventuring skill to 16 for that reason.

This is from Sean Punch (Dr. Kromm) in How to Be a GURPS GM:

"12-13: Primary job skills of most normal people (including cops, doctors, pilots, and soldiers)."

Remember most people, even cops, are typically doing their jobs under known conditions, so have a plus to their effective skill. A friend of mine who was a police lieutenant and built his experience on the streets of Los Angeles said he only pulled his gun while on duty twice (I'm not counting on a firing range). He only fired it on duty once--and that was a warning shot. A PC adventurer is an extreme and unrealistic exception.

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Agreed. In addition, players have found skill levels of 30+ useful in my campaigns, as I will gleefully stack negative modifiers. For example, a character trying to shoot a target during a blizzard (-6 for difficulty) at night (-9 for visibility) from 100 yards away (-10 for range) would only succeed on a 10- with an effective skill of 35. In general, I feel that GMs are not assigning the proper modifiers if skill levels of 16+ are considered 'wasted'.
I've run and played Supers and other high powered games, and we never had skills at that level. But as in all things, it depends on the GM/campaign.

In most movies/comics/stories/certainly in real life, someone who fires a deadly weapon under those conditions either needs psychiatric evaluation or a prison cell.
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Old 10-07-2020, 06:33 PM   #48
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Default Re: The Beauty of GURPS

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Originally Posted by ericthered View Post
I frequently ignore capping talents at 4 levels. Especially IQ-based talents for characters whose concept includes being technically awesome but socially awkward.
I used to cap at 5, but more and more I feel there is no actual reason for a cap. If losing the cap would be a problem, then the talent likely already is one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alden Loveshade View Post
I often like to get my PC's primary adventuring skill to 16 for that reason.
The rule of thumb I use is 12-14-16;
12 is the absolutely minimum for any skill you want to roll against. Less and you're going to constantly curse
14 is the same but for combat skills because you roll more often and expect more penalties
16 is the same but for ranged combat and contested skills, both are hard to succeed at even at 16

Add 4 for any skill you actually want to rely on
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While I do not think that GURPS is perfect I do think that it is more balanced than what I am likely to create by GM fiat.
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Old 10-08-2020, 09:34 AM   #49
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Default Re: The Beauty of GURPS

Although I haven't played such, but I could imagine fairly low skills (say 10-14) common in a gritty and/or horror campaign, where you're basically "supposed to fail" more often than not, or in a "cinematically narrative" campaign, where rolls are less important and focus is on acting out the role (the dice are there but used more as a backup).
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Old 10-08-2020, 04:31 PM   #50
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Default Re: The Beauty of GURPS

Thanks for the advice and examples.

Beyond the statistical likelihood of success and failure on skills, I find the 14 to be a way to persuade noobs er, prospective players, such as in the thread 'how to sell GURPS...' etc.

It's easily understood, they can prove it to themselves rolling dice a few times, and they see how bonuses and modifiers work.

The game where the character can and does fail, and the GM has planned for either way forward, plus the players know this, yes a skill can be 14, they've mentioned it as '90 per cent is good enough.'

Last edited by sgtcallistan; 10-08-2020 at 04:37 PM. Reason: FeiLin made a good right point just above
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