Guardián Demon

b-dog · 07-20-2020, 12:35 PM

Demons in a dungeon are probably one of two types, free demons running around the dungeon in search of prey and guardian demons that guard evil temples, treasure, wizards/liches lairs or some doorway or gate. The free demons would be less likely to be living in a dungeon room and instead roaming around causing trouble. They would be much less likely to fight to the death because if they are slain they will be sent back to the infernal realm. Guardián demons would be more common in dungeon rooms and would be much more likely to fight to the death because I would imagine they would prefer to go back to the infernal realm than to sit in a dungeon room forever, waiting for an intruder to come along. Also whoever put the guardian demon in its spot likely has ordered the demon to fight to the death. Anyway, that leaves who or what has bound the demon to a spot to be a guardian and can this be broken by a mighty enough wizard? Could there be a spell to free the demon from its servitude? And maybe the demon might reward the PC that freed it with some form of service? A free demon might be a lot of trouble or it might serve the PCs for a time and then leave or it might betray the PCs at first opportunity. It could also just leave never to be seen again or it may leave and then rat out the PCs to its demonic superiors. A way to break a demons servitude could pose a lot of interesting role playing. Just a thought.

Yssa · 07-25-2020, 01:09 PM

It's always good to think about the motives of monsters and creative ways to interact them and (try to) get around them. I would love it if my players tried to negotiate a deal with a demon, even if nine times out of ten they demon will betray them.

Your post has also gotten me thinking about what a demon who "lives" in a dungeon does all the time when there aren't meddlesome delvers showing up. I like the idea of a really homey demon room. Of course, the PCs don't have to interact with any of it, but imagine walking into a room and seeing the demon's cozy reading nook, the demon equivalent of a ping-pong table folded against the wall for solo-play, the pantry of demon snacks, posters of the demon's favorite bands. . .

b-dog · 07-25-2020, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yssa

It's always good to think about the motives of monsters and creative ways to interact them and (try to) get around them. I would love it if my players tried to negotiate a deal with a demon, even if nine times out of ten they demon will betray them.

Your post has also gotten me thinking about what a demon who "lives" in a dungeon does all the time when there aren't meddlesome delvers showing up. I like the idea of a really homey demon room. Of course, the PCs don't have to interact with any of it, but imagine walking into a room and seeing the demon's cozy reading nook, the demon equivalent of a ping-pong table folded against the wall for solo-play, the pantry of demon snacks, posters of the demon's favorite bands. . .

I tend to think of demons being resentful and hateful of their duty to guard an area. The demon guarding a treasure is probably going to follow the letter of the command and kill any intruders but if there was a way to dispel the supernatural command and release the demon so that it is free in the mortal realm to kill and corrupt then the demon would be quite pleased. So the demon may negotiate with a powerful wizard to break the demons binding. But once free the demon would have many options. I don’t know if the demon would be reading or have snacks in his room but I imagine the demon would be very bored and would delight in killing an intruder once it got the opportunity. The demon would not break its binding so it may plan a way to get a foolish mortal to help him do so with some sort of break binding spell.

Dalin · 07-25-2020, 05:23 PM

Well, let's see... the Demon of Old (Monsters, p. 20) seems like the most "classic" demon in DFRPG. Looking at its traits, I see a few things that might be relevant to how it spends its time and/or decorates its dormitory:

Bloodlust, Callous, and Sadism — It is mean mean mean to anything it can catch. I could see a lot of tortured dungeon rats (or whatever other subterranean wildlife populates the dungeon).
Detect (Life) — It can find living things to torment pretty easily if they are nearby.
Doesn’t Breathe; Doesn’t Eat or Drink; Doesn’t Sleep — These might indicate against a bed or larder, though I don't see any reason why a particular demon might not choose to enjoy these optional activities.
Immunity to Disease; Immunity to Poison — It has no need for hygiene.
Lifebane — I always forget about this one. Although it is more applicable outdoors, this allows you to provide some subtle details for its indoor prison (the usual dungeon mosses and bugs die off before you get to the guarded treasure).
Temperature Tolerance 10 (Heat) — No reason it's lair needs to be comfortable for standard mammals.

Notably, there are no guidelines for favorite bands, so musical tastes are wide open.

b-dog · 07-25-2020, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dalin

Well, let's see... the Demon of Old (Monsters, p. 20) seems like the most "classic" demon in DFRPG. Looking at its traits, I see a few things that might be relevant to how it spends its time and/or decorates its dormitory:

Bloodlust, Callous, and Sadism — It is mean mean mean to anything it can catch. I could see a lot of tortured dungeon rats (or whatever other subterranean wildlife populates the dungeon).
Detect (Life) — It can find living things to torment pretty easily if they are nearby.
Doesn’t Breathe; Doesn’t Eat or Drink; Doesn’t Sleep — These might indicate against a bed or larder, though I don't see any reason why a particular demon might not choose to enjoy these optional activities.
Immunity to Disease; Immunity to Poison — It has no need for hygiene.
Lifebane — I always forget about this one. Although it is more applicable outdoors, this allows you to provide some subtle details for its indoor prison (the usual dungeon mosses and bugs die off before you get to the guarded treasure).
Temperature Tolerance 10 (Heat) — No reason it's lair needs to be comfortable for standard mammals.

Notably, there are no guidelines for favorite bands, so musical tastes are wide open.

My point is not what the demon is doing recreationally during the time it is guarding whatever it is sentenced to guard. It is more what is forcing the demon to guard something. There should be some sort of magical spell or Infernal command to make a demon sit in a dungeon room for ages when it could roaming around and freely killing and creating havoc. I am sort of thinking of Stormbringer and how the demons there made sense because they were summoned to perform a service like guard something and they did what was requested only because of the spell used to summon them. I was just thinking what if there was a way to break the spell and free the demon of its service instead of just killing it. This might be interesting for an evil wizard or evil cleric to gain allies.

Yssa · 07-25-2020, 08:48 PM

Sorry. . . I really didn't mean to derail your post, the image just popped into my head and made me chuckle.

I do really like your actual idea, and it puts me in mind of the Bartimaeus Sequence by Jonathan Stroud. A quick, spoiler-free explanation: In the series, there are powerful magicians who don't have inherent magic/spellcasting ability, but they know how to summon, bind, and command various demons/spirits/imps/djinn. These beings hate all humans generally, but they REALLY, REALLY hate the specific humans who enslave them, so if any ever get the opportunity to slip out of their bonds (say there is an error in the careful scribing of the pentagram that binds them) they generally choose to attack the summoner and then get out of the material plane (which they also hate) rather than hurt other humans.

This sort of concept could work really well in game, too: PCs might negotiate a cessation of combat on the condition that they deface the binding Pentagram enough to free the demon. Of course, the demon might choose to attack them anyway, or might lie about the nature and effects of the seal, etc.

Dalin · 07-26-2020, 03:08 PM

Apologies, too, for jumping in on a sidetrack!

I basically agree that your first post sounds like excellent fodder for an adventure (or world building).

There might be a spell to break a guardian demon's bonds, but it would likely be a carefully guarded secret. If it were widely distributed, then the market for demon guardians would crash. In DFRPG terms, I might model it on the Banish spell (and include that as a prerequisite). Alternately (or additionally), it might require a customized ritual or quest. Perhaps you need to know the demon's true name (and the name of the original summoner?) which might require Research rolls or locating a hidden tome of lore. Or maybe you need special custom ingredients to break the bonds. Or you need to visit the astral plane and physically cut the enchanted chains. Maybe there are safeguards in place, like a spirit guardian that will appear to defend the ancient wizard's dweomercraft. Plenty of potential here.

It would take some thinking about the particular metaphysics of your game world. Are demons, like fae, bound by their word? If so, then the binding may be in the form of a contract or something. Finding a loophole in the terms could break the spell. Similarly, this might be the way you forge an agreement with a bound demon for how it will help you after you free it. Or, maybe demons aren't bound by such petty things and will merrily roast you over a slow fire after winning its freedom.

b-dog · 07-26-2020, 06:45 PM

Maybe demons could be thought of as being sort of like ghosts with a focus for their energy. Maybe an evil altar, statue, pentagram or spell could be the focus and if the altar or statue is cleansed or the spell is broken then the focus is broken and the demon is no longer able to manifest in the mortal plane. Maybe the demon is in the Infernal Realm but the demon can materialize effortlessly a certain distance or radius from the focus. Maybe the demon is alerted when PCs or other beings get a certain distance from the focus.

Andrew Hackard · 07-27-2020, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b-dog

Demons in a dungeon are probably one of two types,[etc.]

This thread was posted in the DFRPG forum with ZERO content related to that thread. You have been warned about doing this and told to stop; now you're taking a week off while you learn to read and follow instructions.

07-20-2020, 12:35 PM	#1
b-dog Join Date: Nov 2006	Guardián Demon Demons in a dungeon are probably one of two types, free demons running around the dungeon in search of prey and guardian demons that guard evil temples, treasure, wizards/liches lairs or some doorway or gate. The free demons would be less likely to be living in a dungeon room and instead roaming around causing trouble. They would be much less likely to fight to the death because if they are slain they will be sent back to the infernal realm. Guardián demons would be more common in dungeon rooms and would be much more likely to fight to the death because I would imagine they would prefer to go back to the infernal realm than to sit in a dungeon room forever, waiting for an intruder to come along. Also whoever put the guardian demon in its spot likely has ordered the demon to fight to the death. Anyway, that leaves who or what has bound the demon to a spot to be a guardian and can this be broken by a mighty enough wizard? Could there be a spell to free the demon from its servitude? And maybe the demon might reward the PC that freed it with some form of service? A free demon might be a lot of trouble or it might serve the PCs for a time and then leave or it might betray the PCs at first opportunity. It could also just leave never to be seen again or it may leave and then rat out the PCs to its demonic superiors. A way to break a demons servitude could pose a lot of interesting role playing. Just a thought.

07-25-2020, 01:09 PM	#2
Yssa Join Date: Mar 2019	Re: Guardián Demon It's always good to think about the motives of monsters and creative ways to interact them and (try to) get around them. I would love it if my players tried to negotiate a deal with a demon, even if nine times out of ten they demon will betray them. Your post has also gotten me thinking about what a demon who "lives" in a dungeon does all the time when there aren't meddlesome delvers showing up. I like the idea of a really homey demon room. Of course, the PCs don't have to interact with any of it, but imagine walking into a room and seeing the demon's cozy reading nook, the demon equivalent of a ping-pong table folded against the wall for solo-play, the pantry of demon snacks, posters of the demon's favorite bands. . .

07-25-2020, 05:23 PM	#4
Dalin Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Saint Paul, MN	Re: Guardián Demon Well, let's see... the Demon of Old (Monsters, p. 20) seems like the most "classic" demon in DFRPG. Looking at its traits, I see a few things that might be relevant to how it spends its time and/or decorates its dormitory: Bloodlust, Callous, and Sadism — It is mean mean mean to anything it can catch. I could see a lot of tortured dungeon rats (or whatever other subterranean wildlife populates the dungeon). Detect (Life) — It can find living things to torment pretty easily if they are nearby. Doesn’t Breathe; Doesn’t Eat or Drink; Doesn’t Sleep — These might indicate against a bed or larder, though I don't see any reason why a particular demon might not choose to enjoy these optional activities. Immunity to Disease; Immunity to Poison — It has no need for hygiene. Lifebane — I always forget about this one. Although it is more applicable outdoors, this allows you to provide some subtle details for its indoor prison (the usual dungeon mosses and bugs die off before you get to the guarded treasure). Temperature Tolerance 10 (Heat) — No reason it's lair needs to be comfortable for standard mammals. Notably, there are no guidelines for favorite bands, so musical tastes are wide open.

07-25-2020, 08:48 PM	#6
Yssa Join Date: Mar 2019	Re: Guardián Demon Sorry. . . I really didn't mean to derail your post, the image just popped into my head and made me chuckle. I do really like your actual idea, and it puts me in mind of the Bartimaeus Sequence by Jonathan Stroud. A quick, spoiler-free explanation: In the series, there are powerful magicians who don't have inherent magic/spellcasting ability, but they know how to summon, bind, and command various demons/spirits/imps/djinn. These beings hate all humans generally, but they REALLY, REALLY hate the specific humans who enslave them, so if any ever get the opportunity to slip out of their bonds (say there is an error in the careful scribing of the pentagram that binds them) they generally choose to attack the summoner and then get out of the material plane (which they also hate) rather than hurt other humans. This sort of concept could work really well in game, too: PCs might negotiate a cessation of combat on the condition that they deface the binding Pentagram enough to free the demon. Of course, the demon might choose to attack them anyway, or might lie about the nature and effects of the seal, etc.

07-26-2020, 03:08 PM	#7
Dalin Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Saint Paul, MN	Re: Guardián Demon Apologies, too, for jumping in on a sidetrack! I basically agree that your first post sounds like excellent fodder for an adventure (or world building). There might be a spell to break a guardian demon's bonds, but it would likely be a carefully guarded secret. If it were widely distributed, then the market for demon guardians would crash. In DFRPG terms, I might model it on the Banish spell (and include that as a prerequisite). Alternately (or additionally), it might require a customized ritual or quest. Perhaps you need to know the demon's true name (and the name of the original summoner?) which might require Research rolls or locating a hidden tome of lore. Or maybe you need special custom ingredients to break the bonds. Or you need to visit the astral plane and physically cut the enchanted chains. Maybe there are safeguards in place, like a spirit guardian that will appear to defend the ancient wizard's dweomercraft. Plenty of potential here. It would take some thinking about the particular metaphysics of your game world. Are demons, like fae, bound by their word? If so, then the binding may be in the form of a contract or something. Finding a loophole in the terms could break the spell. Similarly, this might be the way you forge an agreement with a bound demon for how it will help you after you free it. Or, maybe demons aren't bound by such petty things and will merrily roast you over a slow fire after winning its freedom.

07-26-2020, 06:45 PM	#8
b-dog Join Date: Nov 2006	Re: Guardián Demon Maybe demons could be thought of as being sort of like ghosts with a focus for their energy. Maybe an evil altar, statue, pentagram or spell could be the focus and if the altar or statue is cleansed or the spell is broken then the focus is broken and the demon is no longer able to manifest in the mortal plane. Maybe the demon is in the Infernal Realm but the demon can materialize effortlessly a certain distance or radius from the focus. Maybe the demon is alerted when PCs or other beings get a certain distance from the focus. Last edited by b-dog; 07-27-2020 at 09:55 AM.