10-03-2013, 08:40 AM | #21 | ||
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Re: Disabling a car's engine
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10-03-2013, 09:42 AM | #22 | ||
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Brighton
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Re: Disabling a car's engine
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Human torso: p- x0.5 Human heart p- x3 therefore Human heart is 6x more susceptible Car torso: p- x0.33r car engine block p- x3 therefore car engine block 9x more susceptible and the engine block is 1.5x more susceptible to p- than the human heart is when compared to their 'chassis'. The point about being more vulnerable than the rest of the structure in general is made by the x3 vital multiplier. I view unliving as an inherent description of the substance in question (including the substance of the vitals). Part of the problem here is that the engine block is actually one of the tougher parts of the car As evidenced by the cover it gives. So it may be that engine block as whole isn't actually a very good candidate for being a vital. i.e yes if you get a bullet that penetrates into the engine block it's obviously not good but that actually a bit harder than just shooting through the hood. Actually someone mentioned location specific DR, maybe that is the way to go. That all aside I think my examples fit reasonable expectation pretty well. Last edited by Tomsdad; 10-04-2013 at 03:06 AM. |
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10-03-2013, 09:51 AM | #23 |
Join Date: May 2009
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Re: Disabling a car's engine
I am not sure where I come down on the "do the modifiers for vitals and IT(unliving) multiply" question, but I am beginning to think the engine block is not the vitals of the car.
I think the engine block is more likely to be the Torso equivalent with the smaller more vulnerable components, on board computers, fuel lines, battery etc, being considered the Vitals. The majority of the rest of the car is more like the limbs, capped damage, IT(no blood) and IT(unliving) combine to represent that there is very little to be damaged and a shot clean through with no lasting effects is entirely possible.
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Maxwell Kensington "Snotkins" Von Smacksalot III |
10-03-2013, 10:08 AM | #24 | ||||
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Re: Disabling a car's engine
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Now since you mean relatively...what do you think shooting a 'tiny' hole through a person's body does? Really rather a lot of unpleasantness, is what. Not too likely to physically incapacitate them, but bad things. What do you think shooting the same hole through the body of a car does? Most likely makes a few ventilation holes you could cover with pocket change and has no noticeable effect on function or sturdiness. If you shoot a little hole through a person's heart or lungs or what have you, that's pretty bad. But if you shoot a hole through a car's engine block, what do you think happens? Now, of course, you might not be able to shoot through the engine block... Quote:
I say it's a clear vitals location because it is a good place to shoot to stop a car with higher-power weapons, like a .50 BMG rifle or machinegun. Quote:
And the idea that it changes the nature of vitals seems exactly contradicted by the actual rules, so.
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10-04-2013, 03:42 AM | #25 | |||||||
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Brighton
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Re: Disabling a car's engine
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In terms of tissue there strength and density etc, teh heart and lungs are roughly analogous to the rest of the bodies tissues. It's the impairment of their function that makes them well vital. They are not easier to damage then the rest of the body, its just that the effects of damage on them is more pronounced. By removing the unliving penalty your basically double dipping, you saying that not only is a engine block vital in terms of the repercussion of any damage done to and how it effects the vehicle in question but that its also made of material that is it else far more susceptible to damage. I.e you've made the engine block analogous to a big living muscle under the hood that vital to the function of the car, not a big metal unliving component that's under the hood that's vital to the function of the car. Now that happens to an extent with living targets when you replace the weapon wounding mod with the location mod, but in general it goes the other way and isn't as pronounced Quote:
But will need to hit a lot with 9mm, Quote:
To take your example sure if it's unlinking metal underneath I agree, but that's the opposite of what your showing which is a metal car with a metal body with the effects of unliving, but the cars vitals are as prone to damage as living tissue vitals. Quote:
all else being equal a P wound to a human vital is 3x worse than wound to the body, in yours it's 9x worse for cars a p- wound is 6x worse for humans, 15x worse in cars a P+ wound is 2x worse for humans, 6x worse in cars a P++ wound is 1.5x worse for a human, 3x worse in cars Now if you were arguing that engine blocks are more susceptible to large calibre rounds than I might agree, but your system actually favours the smaller rounds. Sorry, some of yesterdays posts were based on p- wounds being x1/3 in unliving not x1/5! Last edited by Tomsdad; 10-04-2013 at 03:55 AM. |
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10-04-2013, 02:18 PM | #26 |
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: South yorkshire, united kingdom
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Re: Disabling a car's engine
Gurps hp and damage are an abstraction. A vital hit to the engine block does not have to represent a penetration of the block its self to count as a vital hit. I am no mechanic nor weapons expert but I would expect most rounds sub .50bmg will bounce off the block into some equally vital part of the engine. After all the engine bay of a car is one place you dont want bullets bouncing around in.
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10-04-2013, 02:33 PM | #27 | |||
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Re: Disabling a car's engine
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Unliving things can be made of steel, or superdense hypermaterials. Or they can be made of plastic. Or balsa wood. Or meat, for that matter. Quote:
It's not 'my system'. It is the actual rules.
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10-04-2013, 06:44 PM | #28 |
Banned
Join Date: Apr 2008
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Re: Disabling a car's engine
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10-04-2013, 07:05 PM | #29 |
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Re: Disabling a car's engine
...no. Seriously, the Basic Set is crystal clear on this.
EDIT: as I recently cited in another thread: "Certain attacks can target the vitals for increased damage. Increase the wounding modifier for an impaling or any piercing attack to x3. Increase the wounding modifier for a tight-beam burning attack to x2"
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I don't know any 3e, so there is no chance that I am talking about 3e rules by accident. |
10-05-2013, 05:30 AM | #30 |
Banned
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: Disabling a car's engine
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firearms, high tech, vehicles, vitals |
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