TK-assisted punching and Limited Use

[Plasmabunny]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

Rapid Strike wouldn't work anyway, since Rapid Strike lets you make two attacks with one Attack maneuver, and Telekinesis requires you to take a Concentrate maneuver. They're incompatible.

That's not quite correct,

"Telekinesis requires constant concentration
to use. In combat, this
means you must take a Concentrate
maneuver on your turn. Your TK may
then perform one standard maneuver
as if were a disembodied pair of hands
at some point within your range: a
Ready maneuver to pick up an object;
a Move maneuver to lift and carry it;
an Attack maneuver to throw it, or to
grab or strike directly; and so on."

Since the Telekinesis uses a Standard maneuver, it can make an attack (and use a rapid strike.) By RAW telekinesis could even make an All-Out attack since it's a standard maneuver, without causing the user to lose their defenses. I'm not sure I'd play it that way though...

[AmesJainchill]

If I have Extra Attack, would that apply to my attacks with my TK?

[Kelly Pedersen]

Originally Posted by Plasmabunny

Since the Telekinesis uses a Standard maneuver, it can make an attack (and use a rapid strike.)

True, but that wasn't really what was discussed - AmesJainchill was talking about using Rapid Strike to make one attack with a punch, then the second attack as the TK punch to add the damages together. At least, I assume that's what he meant. You can certainly try to to a Rapid Strike TK punch, I agree. In fact, with Telegraphic Attack, it might even be a pretty good idea, since the opponent is at a penalty to defend since the attack is invisible.

Originally Posted by Plasmabunny

By RAW telekinesis could even make an All-Out attack since it's a standard maneuver, without causing the user to lose their defenses.

Hmm. I don't think I'd allow that. It strikes me as unbalanced - if you want the benefits of an All-Out Attack, you'll have to pay the price, too - no defenses.

[Kelly Pedersen]

Originally Posted by AmesJainchill

If I have Extra Attack, would that apply to my attacks with my TK?

Only if you took it with the Multi-Strike enhancement. Otherwise, with Extra Attack you need to attack with two different attacks (fist and foot, claw and bite, whatever), which Telekinesis would make impossible, since if you're attacking with TK, you can't attack with anything else.

[talonthehand]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

Hmm. I don't think I'd allow that. It strikes me as unbalanced - if you want the benefits of an All-Out Attack, you'll have to pay the price, too - no defenses.

Agreed, though if the setting had an abundance of mental attacks, I might allow an All-Out TK attack that didn't let you have a Will or IQ resist roll for the turn (sort of a mental all-out instead of a physical all-out).

[Plasmabunny]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

True, but that wasn't really what was discussed - AmesJainchill was talking about using Rapid Strike to make one attack with a punch, then the second attack as the TK punch to add the damages together. At least, I assume that's what he meant.

Ah, sorry about that. I looked at the post again, and I'm not sure how I missed that.

Actually, it might be possible to use telekinesis to "aid" punching and take advantage of a rapid strike... If you use your telekinesis to hit your enemy with your fist... You could punch AND then use telekinesis as well ;)

[Kelly Pedersen]

Originally Posted by Plasmabunny

Actually, it might be possible to use telekinesis to "aid" punching and take advantage of a rapid strike... If you use your telekinesis to hit your enemy with your fist... You could punch AND then use telekinesis as well ;)

It still wouldn't really be the same thing, though. You could certainly use your TK to move your hand in a punch (and that would be a good trick to fool someone into thinking you were a lot stronger than you were - use your TK 50 to move your fist to hit someone!), but you wouldn't be able to stack it with the actual punching damage. While you're controlling the TK, you don't have the concentration available to put your muscles behind a punch, IMO.

[Plasmabunny]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

It still wouldn't really be the same thing, though. You could certainly use your TK to move your hand in a punch (and that would be a good trick to fool someone into thinking you were a lot stronger than you were - use your TK 50 to move your fist to hit someone!), but you wouldn't be able to stack it with the actual punching damage. While you're controlling the TK, you don't have the concentration available to put your muscles behind a punch, IMO.

I didn't mean to imply using TK to add to the ST of your attack, I meant using your fist as an improvised weapon wielded by your telekinesis ;).

I wonder what the ST cap on that would be... :D

[Kelly Pedersen]

Originally Posted by Plasmabunny

I wonder what the ST cap on that would be... :D

It's an interesting question. I think the body has enough tolerance in it that you can put more strength behind a punch than you actually have in your muscles. But how much more? Offhand, I'd peg the "Min ST" of your limbs at your ST/2. So if you've got ST 10, you wouldn't be able to treat your fist as more than ST 15 when using your TK to punch things with it.

[AmesJainchill]

Originally Posted by Plasmabunny

Ah, sorry about that. I looked at the post again, and I'm not sure how I missed that.

Actually, it might be possible to use telekinesis to "aid" punching and take advantage of a rapid strike... If you use your telekinesis to hit your enemy with your fist... You could punch AND then use telekinesis as well ;)

Yep, that's what I meant by a Rapid Strike.