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Old 05-23-2020, 11:13 PM   #1
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Default '39 _Maxi_

Kind-of quiet around here, so I decided to fiddle around with a _VG1_ design which hadn't been upgraded.

2039 Cycle Concepts _Maxi_

Heavy Cycle; Hv. Susp.; Su. PP w/PC; 2x PR tire; Cyclist. RL [F]; SD [B]; Link (SD - SS), Smart Link (RLs). Armor: F, B: 15; 2x 10-pt. CWG. $6,760; 1,295 lbs.

Heavy Sidecar; Im. Suspension, 1x PR tire., RL [F]; SS [B]; Jettison Joinings. Armor: F, O, B: 2; 7-pt CWG. $3,200; 750 lbs.

Total: $9,960; 2,045 lbs. Acc.: 10; TS: 120; HC: 3.

For just under $10K, one gets a very fast, very hard to hit, reasonably well armored (even the tires are now protected) bike with a forward battery normally found on cars costing twice as much. The sidecar's light armor is balanced by the ability to ditch it if it does get shot to pieces, a feature missing on the original.
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Old 05-24-2020, 09:20 PM   #2
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Default Re: '39 _Maxi_

Probably one of the best cycle raider designs in AM's stock car list was by Metro (not my design):

Cur -- Heavy Cycle, Heavy suspension, Super Cycle power plant w/PC, 10-pt CA (Power Plant), 2 Motorcycle Puncture-Resistant tires, Cyclist w/TC and 10-pt CA, Micromissile Launcher Front, Spikedropper Back w/10 Explosive Spikes, Link (all HRs, MML), Link (all HRs), Plastic Armor: F19, B19, 2 10-pt Cycle Wheelguards, Acceleration 10, Top Speed 120, HC 3, 1298 lbs., $7506

Heavy Sidecar, Improved Suspension, Motorcycle Puncture-Resistant tire, Jettison Joinings, 3 Heavy Rockets Front, Plastic Armor: F3, R3, B3, 10-pt Cycle Wheelguard, 749 lbs., $2145
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Old 05-25-2020, 02:47 PM   #3
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Default Re: '39 _Maxi_

Quote:
Originally Posted by juris View Post
Probably one of the best cycle raider designs in AM's stock car list was by Metro (not my design):
My _Pilum_ has a similar sidecar; the cycle itself also has 3x HR linked F. Run it up to an opponent; "volley the pila" from the sidecar, then from the cycle; if the target is still functional, pull a Slade[*]. Inexpensive, and reasonably effective.

[*: " o/~ RUN RUNAWAY! o/~ " >;) ]

The idea for the _Maxi_ upgrade was to run with the name -- how many cycles can sustain a 4d6 attack over ten turns? Annoyingly, this does require a Smart Link; IMSMC, the SL is required for aimed fire between a cycle and its sidecar.
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Old 05-27-2020, 04:28 PM   #4
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Default Re: '39 _Maxi_

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Originally Posted by 43Supporter View Post
IMSMC, the SL is required for aimed fire between a cycle and its sidecar.
My understanding was that it was not possible to link aimed weapons between a side car and the cycle by ANY means.

However this is also clearly nonsense since the weapons are probably even closer together than the linked weapons on the front arc of a car would be (if the classic one on each wing meme is legitimate). In our games you can link weapons between a sidecar and the bike with an ordinary link.
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Old 05-27-2020, 05:20 PM   #5
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Default Re: '39 _Maxi_

Totally agree - nuisance inconsistent rulings like this were clearly nonsense. No need for a LB with a gas burner TL. Trikes with R&L weapon shouldn't need a smart link. Especially after there were published AADA VG designs incorporating this equipment.

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However this is also clearly nonsense since the weapons are probably even closer together than the linked weapons on the front arc of a car would be (if the classic one on each wing meme is legitimate). In our games you can link weapons between a sidecar and the bike with an ordinary link.
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Old 05-28-2020, 03:15 PM   #6
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Default Re: '39 _Maxi_

As I said: If memory serves, that was the ruling at the time -- a cycle and its sidecar were considered "different facings", the same way a car's turret and sides were considered "separate"; so that's what I went with. (Here's where a wiki would be useful -- something where one can say "At the time, ruling was [a]; then it became [b] here", among other questions.)
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Old 05-28-2020, 03:52 PM   #7
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Default Re: '39 _Maxi_

It's been so long since anything was posted on this Old Editions forum that I culled all my reference materials and PDFs from my hard drive to save space.

If we are going to start serious posting again I'll have to reinstall it all. Then I'll be able to give you a definitive answer. I don't think the reference is particularly buried though. If memory serves the question of linking weapons between a bike and the side car is right there in the cycle design rules section under Weapon Placement (and probably has been there since B&W Delux or even earlier).

EDIT:
Linked weapons were pretty vague in 3rd Edition, but Delux (1985) definitely states that weapons on the bike cannot be linked to weapons on the sidecar unless they are BOTH dropped weapons. The same wording is in Compendium 2.5 and UACFH. That in theory kyboshes the popular aimed weapon linked to a dropped weapon setup. This is even more foolish. IGNORE IT, you have my permission ;)

Last edited by swordtart; 05-29-2020 at 01:33 PM. Reason: The rules were even more broken than I thought
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Old 05-29-2020, 01:46 PM   #8
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Default Re: '39 _Maxi_

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Originally Posted by 43Supporter View Post
...Here's where a wiki would be useful -- something where one can say "At the time, ruling was [a]; then it became [b] here", among other questions.)
Sadly it would likely end up as ruling was [a]; then it became [b] here", but it was also [c] at tournaments run by X and [d] at tournaments run by Y. Z always held that it should have been [e] all along and when he became editor of the month he changed it - in subsequent ADQ&A his opinion was however largely ignored.

;(

Last edited by swordtart; 05-29-2020 at 01:55 PM.
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Old 05-29-2020, 02:00 PM   #9
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Default Re: '39 _Maxi_

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Originally Posted by swordtart View Post
Sadly it would likely end up as ruling was [a]; then it became [b] here", but it was also [c] at tournaments run by X and [d] at tournaments run by Y. Z always held that it should have been [e] all along and when he became editor of the month he changed it - in subsequent ADQ&A his opinion was however largely ignored.

;(
True -- but it would still be useful info.

I may start silly-walking the ADQ&As later. For the nonce, I'm going with "use a Smart Link".
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Old 05-29-2020, 02:04 PM   #10
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Default Re: '39 _Maxi_

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Originally Posted by juris View Post
Probably one of the best cycle raider designs in AM's stock car list was by Metro (not my design):
Whoa the pony... I don't object to linking identical weapons on cycles to sidecars, but linking an MML in the bike to HR's in the sidecar?

Is the intention really to fire off those HR's on AUTOMATIC? Taking an already woefully inaccurate weapon and piling on inaccuracy?

If they were laser guided* that would be different.


*Now that reminds me. I think in an ADQ&A someone allowed laser guided rockets in a sidecar to be fired with a laser on the bike as the rockets "were not aimed". But according to the ruling pointed out in a few posts above both the laser and the rockets would need to be considered dropped weapons for a link to be permissible.

The defence moves for an immediate acquittal...
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