Monster Death Mechanics...

[Macabre]

Had an situation come up with a game of basic munchkin, and couldn't find any specific rulings VIA the FAQ or rules itself.

When you are fighting a monster and someone kills it with a card such as Dues Ex, or Grave error is there a window to counter play? Or is the monster immediately gone, combat ends?

One person played Grave Error to instantly kill an undead monster from the player taking the winning combat from 9 to 10, can the other person still play polymorph potion or a similar effect that gets rid of the monster but lets you keep the treasure and or loot the room? If both can be played which takes priority?

[Clipper]

It depends on the card. Typically there is no way to stop the monster from being removed. Pretty much the only card I can think of that can do that is Annihilation, because it can cancel any card (Edit: provided you play Annihilation immediately after the other card). However, combat doesn't always end immediately after all monsters are removed. If the card says something like it ends the combat or that you can loot the room, then it finishes the battle and no more Wandering Monsters can be played. On the other hand, if it says it just removes a monster from the combat or a monster leaves its treasure behind, then it doesn't end the combat and people might still interfere with Wandering Monsters and so on.

In your example, I'll start by saying that I assume you mean the 'other person' is the one in combat who would have gotten the winning level if it weren't for Grave Error being played by the 'one person'. In this case, the combat player cannot play Pollymorph Potion as Grave Error needs to be completely resolved first, and by the time it finishes resolving, there are no more monsters to morph with the potion.

What the combat player could do in that situation, if he had the cards, is use Wandering Monster to bring a new creature into combat to fight it. He would get the winning level if he could do that as Grave Error does not say it ended the combat.

To clarify priority, you have to completely resolve each card in the order played before moving to the next card, unless the second card states it interrupts the play of the first somehow (like with Annihilation, or with Loaded Die interrupting a die roll you might make). Pollymorph Potion has no such text.

[MunchkinMan]

Originally Posted by Clipper

It depends on the card. Typically there is no way to stop the monster from being removed. Pretty much the only card I can think of that can do that is Annihilation, because it can cancel any card. However, combat doesn't always end immediately after all monsters are removed. If the card says something like it ends the combat or that you can loot the room, then it finishes the battle and no more Wandering Monsters can be played. On the other hand, if it says it just removes a monster from the combat or a monster leaves its treasure behind, then it doesn't end the combat and people might still interfere with Wandering Monsters and so on.

In your example, I'll start by saying that I assume you mean the 'other person' is the one in combat who would have gotten the winning level if it weren't for Grave Error being played by the 'one person'. In this case, the combat player cannot play Pollymorph Potion as Grave Error needs to be completely resolved first, and by the time it finishes resolving, there are no more monsters to morph with the potion.

What the combat player could do in that situation, if he had the cards, is use Wandering Monster to bring a new creature into combat to fight it. He would get the winning level if he could do that as Grave Error does not say it ended the combat.

To clarify priority, you have to completely resolve each card in the order played before moving to the next card, unless the second card states it interrupts the play of the first somehow (like with Annihilation, or with Loaded Die interrupting a die roll you might make). Pollymorph Potion has no such text.

Annihilation only cancels cards that were just played by another player. This is not the same as canceling any card, as that would imply that any card could be canceled no matter when it was played, creating a problem with timing, especially one that has a natural timing, like Munchkin. Annihilation can remove previously played cards, yes, but that's not quite the same as canceling a card. For example, there are cards which prevent people, or one person, from playing cards against a certain player in a combat, and one could cancel one of those cards with Annihilation when it was played, but not remove it later, since that would be playing cards against that player.

Otherwise, yes. Once the last Monster is removed from combat, there is usually still time to Wander in a Monster in order to prevent combat from coming to an end. However, if a card says that combat is over, or forces the player(s) to Run Away, or implies that combat is over by having an ongoing effect on all Monsters (like Monsters Are Busy or Out To Lunch) in that combat, that's it.

[Clipper]

I'm a little confused now. I was thinking that if you immediately played Annihilation as an interrupt when Grave Error was played, you could cancel the effect of Grave Error and this is the usage I attempted to imply in my response.

I mean, if it can be used to cancel Divine Intervention, which doesn't remain in play after it is resolved, then it seems it would have to work as an interrupt card that can interrupt and cancel the play of any other card too.

Of course, once you have let Grave Error resolve, it is too late to use Annihilation due to the reasons you mentioned.

Edit: And I just realised this could just be an argument of semantics. I said it 'can cancel any card', but I neglected to mention 'but only if you play it immediately after the card' which I didn't deem necessary. If that sentence alone is taken out of context, I can understand why you added the additional info, which I then took out of context as a correction rather than additional comments. I'm no longer confused.

[Macabre]

Alright that answers my question, thanks. So it sounds like anything short of annhilation being played immediately would allow the Grave error or similar card to resolve first and clear the monster.