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Old 08-29-2018, 11:31 AM   #1
Lameth
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Default Could Magic be kept secret?

I am going to run a modern game, alla a minor supers game with traces of adventure, mystery, pulp, martial arts, and mystical arts. Innate super powers have only been around for about 10 years, and only about 3 years publically.

In the world, there is a secret world, behind the secret world, of those that possess arcane knowledge and live the life. If real magic [Path/Book, more subtle then flashy, more pulp action/mystery cults then D&D] has been around for the last 120 years or so, could it have been kept secret by its users from the public at large?

Could magic of a small population group world wide, maybe 150 people, be kept secret in the modern world?

Side Note:
If you like comics and have not read The Magic Order, please do its fantastic and an inspiration that I am using for a hidden magical backdrop behind the world of pulp action supers in a changing world where powers are starting to show up. And to a smaller extent, from DC the new comic of The Justice League Dark.
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Old 08-29-2018, 11:37 AM   #2
johndallman
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Default Re: Could Magic be kept secret?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lameth View Post
Could magic of a small population group world wide, maybe 150 people, be kept secret in the modern world?
If people with the talent for magic need training before they can use it, and there is an organisation with a monopoly which is really careful about who it selects for training, then it might well be kept secret. If people manifest magic unpredictably and without training, no chance.
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Old 08-29-2018, 11:40 AM   #3
ericthered
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Default Re: Could Magic be kept secret?

The key to this is to have every member of the group dedicated to keeping magic secret, and giving magic enough tools to stay secret with minimal loss of profit.

Magicians should have strong ties to each other and minimal ties to the outside world. Pay close attention to family, coworkers, and neighbors.


An explicit desire to keep it secret and firm (if perhaps implict) penalties for people who break cover.
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Old 08-29-2018, 11:44 AM   #4
Lameth
 
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Default Re: Could Magic be kept secret?

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Originally Posted by johndallman View Post
If people with the talent for magic need training before they can use it, and there is an organisation with a monopoly which is really careful about who it selects for training, then it might well be kept secret. If people manifest magic unpredictably and without training, no chance.
No, Magery is required to use any magic and it takes dedication, time, resources, and the correct source materials to learn from. Its not spontaneous, but more a thing of education, learning and time.
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Old 08-29-2018, 11:50 AM   #5
johndallman
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Default Re: Could Magic be kept secret?

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Originally Posted by Lameth View Post
Magery is required to use any magic and it takes dedication, time, resources, and the correct source materials to learn from. It is not spontaneous, but more a thing of education, learning and time.
OK, given that, and this policy:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericthered View Post
The key to this is to have every member of the group dedicated to keeping magic secret, and giving magic enough tools to stay secret with minimal loss of profit.
It is possible for magic to stay secret. You'll want to look very carefully at the Path/Book rituals list, and consider modifying or deleting some of them. You might well make it purely Book magic, with devising a new ritual being a work of years.
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Old 08-29-2018, 12:02 PM   #6
Lameth
 
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Default Re: Could Magic be kept secret?

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Originally Posted by johndallman View Post
OK, given that, and this policy:

It is possible for magic to stay secret. You'll want to look very carefully at the Path/Book rituals list, and consider modifying or deleting some of them. You might well make it purely Book magic, with devising a new ritual being a work of years.
My thought was just that. 99% of magic is Book Magic. All books are mostly known or heard of, and there is a finite number of them. Many books are scattered and divided up ["I found page 22-28 of the Book of the Black Sun"]. This will allow someone to buy a book, yet not start with everything in that book. Book magic's core skill in Ritual Magic, and Magery is needed.

There is a minor form of folk or minor magic out there for the minor conjures, I was thinking default from Occultism or other esoteric skill, and make it a few minor paths instead of books. Magic of minor illusions, faster self healing, slight of hand magic, mesmerism, etc. Mystery men magic of the 1920's and 40's. Magery or some form or special advantage is needed for these as well, maybe Trained By Master, or a Chi Advantage, etc.
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Old 08-29-2018, 12:08 PM   #7
Anaraxes
 
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Default Re: Could Magic be kept secret?

If magic is sufficiently subtle, it might not be truly secret, yet still not a factor in most people's minds. If those untrained mages only manifest magic like premonitions, luck (whether with dice like TK, or bad things happening to their rivals), inexplicable sales skill or even celebrity, then no one's going to think of it magical talent manifesting. We call that kind of thing ESP, luck good and bad, various ineffable talents like charisma, and of course just plain hoaxes and BS along with statistics. Few people in the modern world really believe in magic, and there's not a secret Illuminati organization hiding all those traces and actively making sure we disbelieve. (Or so I think :)) Subtlety and unreliability, at least until you do get that training from the Ancient One, are the keys to plausibility on this path.

Though feel free to put in a Cabal if that suits. It'll fit right into that sort of game.
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Old 08-29-2018, 12:08 PM   #8
SteamBub
 
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Default Re: Could Magic be kept secret?

There are occult clubs and groups that do study "magick." I would imagine that most of the clubs are fronts for true magick users were they can scout potential recruits. Since most clubs tend to keep their "studies" secret, you can test if they are trust worthy.

Also one setting book you might want to look into is the Cabal. Does the urban fantasy thing pretty well.
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Old 08-29-2018, 12:12 PM   #9
Lameth
 
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Default Re: Could Magic be kept secret?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaraxes View Post
If magic is sufficiently subtle, it might not be truly secret, yet still not a factor in most people's minds. If those untrained mages only manifest magic like premonitions, luck (whether with dice like TK, or bad things happening to their rivals), inexplicable sales skill or even celebrity, then no one's going to think of it magical talent manifesting. We call that kind of thing ESP, luck good and bad, various ineffable talents like charisma, and of course just plain hoaxes and BS along with statistics. Few people in the modern world really believe in magic, and there's not a secret Illuminati organization hiding all those traces and actively making sure we disbelieve. (Or so I think :)) Subtlety and unreliability, at least until you do get that training from the Ancient One, are the keys to plausibility on this path.

Though feel free to put in a Cabal if that suits. It'll fit right into that sort of game.
well not all magic is subtle..i still want the sleep clouds, flashes, charm, invisibility, fire conjuring, but they are more rare and harder to perform.
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Old 08-29-2018, 12:17 PM   #10
Lameth
 
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Default Re: Could Magic be kept secret?

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Originally Posted by SteamBub View Post
There are occult clubs and groups that do study "magick." I would imagine that most of the clubs are fronts for true magick users were they can scout potential recruits. Since most clubs tend to keep their "studies" secret, you can test if they are trust worthy.

Also one setting book you might want to look into is the Cabal. Does the urban fantasy thing pretty well.
good point and I love the book, but the magic moves to much into the extreme level of Deacons and hermatic. Fitting for my Horror secret magic game, not a pulp action hero game I think. I was more aiming for a more arcane yet simplified theory of magic, more comic book and myth, then hard grounded world thaumaturgy. Yes magic will have its various "colors", like witch craft, Voodoo, etc., but in essence those are only the themes and tools used...behind it all, its all magic with different uses, thought processes, and "lenses" I guess.

Last edited by Lameth; 08-29-2018 at 12:21 PM.
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