Wall Innate Attack - Encase the target?

[RicoZaid]

Is it possible to create an Innate Attack + Wall (60%) to encase a target?

How much area to encase a normal size person?

Thanks!

Here's what I'm running:
Force Wall (Innate Attack: Crush) 18
No Wounding, -50%; no die roll 2 points/level, +0%;
Wall, +60%; Persistent , +40%; Area of Affect, 4
yards, +100%; No Blunt Trauma, -20%; Range 5x,
+20%; No Knockback, -10%; Hovering, +10%; Magic,
-10%. [87]

[Varyon]

What you're looking for is the Binding Advantage, not some version of Innate Attack.

[Kelly Pedersen]

Originally Posted by Varyon

What you're looking for is the Binding Advantage, not some version of Innate Attack.

I'd actually disagree, at least partially. While you can't use Innate Attack with Wall to hold someone immobile (that is, indeed, the realm of Binding), I don't see why you couldn't use a Wall to create a sphere with a person inside. They'd be able to move about within the sphere, attack it, and so forth, but the Wall can be created enclosing them, at least.

[RicoZaid]

How much area to encase a normal size person?

I get 1x3x4 yards because of the AoE advantage (+100%). Is that correct?

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

I'd actually disagree, at least partially. While you can't use Innate Attack with Wall to hold someone immobile (that is, indeed, the realm of Binding), I don't see why you couldn't use a Wall to create a sphere with a person inside. They'd be able to move about within the sphere, attack it, and so forth, but the Wall can be created enclosing them, at least.

I may have been too hasty - I simply assumed the intent was to create an effect to bind the foe, in which case Binding is the way to go, but walling someone in should probably be an option as well. Unfortunately, I can't find anywhere in the books that defines the height of a Wall created by IA, if stacking is an option, or if you can do a scheme to place a Wall suspended between other Walls. Going with how GURPS often works, I'll assume 4-yard tall Walls (4 yards is the height of a standard hex; no, I don't get it either).

Basically, what you'll need is to have the +60% version of Wall (the +30% one probably just lets you build a straight one that's only 4 yards tall), then fill up each hex surrounding the target. You'll stack another Wall on top of those, then fill the area between. Note this creates a dome, not a sphere - you'd have to create the Wall in the ground, which I don't think is an option.

[Kelly Pedersen]

I agree that the default height for a Wall should be 4 yards. Personally, I think the +60% version of Wall should be enough to potentially trap someone with just one use, provided it's long enough - it says you can "form it into any shape you choose" at that level, and I think that's enough to allow you to reshape it into a circle, effectively. I would definitely require a big enough Wall to encircle the target without touching them, though. I think, for a standard human, that's going to require a 2-yard radius, large enough to make a 6-yard long wall. A single 1-yard radius Wall isn't quite enough to encircle a standard 1-yard hex.

Also, some can try to dodge out of this sort of thing as you cast it, with a Dodge and Drop - against a six-yard-long Wall, which effectively circles one hex, I'd give anyone a chance to dodge out, and even a wider circle could still potentially be dodgeable if someone had more than a 1-yard Step, thus allowing a longer Dodge and Drop.

[RicoZaid]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

I think, for a standard human, that's going to require a 2-yard radius, large enough to make a 6-yard long wall. A single 1-yard radius Wall isn't quite enough to encircle a standard 1-yard hex.

Cool.

So with the 12 yards of wall I have I could fully encase 2 adjacent people before they were hit by an attack?

It's hard for me to visualize the math without hexes.

I'd like to be able to save a crowd of people so maybe I'll drop the DR and get more area.

Thanks!

[Kelly Pedersen]

Originally Posted by RicoZaid

So with the 12 yards of wall I have I could fully encase 2 adjacent people before they were hit by an attack?

Yeah, I'd allow it. I'd say that every 6 yards of Wall length translates to one hex you can encircle. So your 12 yards nicely covers 2 hexes (actually, every 6 yards covers something more like "a hex and a bit", and there should be some efficiencies since you're not actually fully encircling each hex anyway, but it works as a rule of thumb).

[RicoZaid]

Originally Posted by Hellboy

I don't think so. Wall (B109) says:

three-yard-long by one-yard-wide wall per yard of radius in your area...

While Wall is based on AE, it basically just replaces it, because it creates a wall 3x longer than the dimension of area.

Awesome math skills.

Does the wall advantage create 3 one yard cubes? Then added AoE multiples the number of cubes?

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

I agree that the default height for a Wall should be 4 yards. Personally, I think the +60% version of Wall should be enough to potentially trap someone with just one use, provided it's long enough - it says you can "form it into any shape you choose" at that level, and I think that's enough to allow you to reshape it into a circle, effectively. I would definitely require a big enough Wall to encircle the target without touching them, though. I think, for a standard human, that's going to require a 2-yard radius, large enough to make a 6-yard long wall. A single 1-yard radius Wall isn't quite enough to encircle a standard 1-yard hex.

I'd require a 3-yard radius. 2 yards is enough to create an encircling wall, but not to give it a roof. To give it that, you need to basically build another wall on top of the first and fill in the hex that you left empty on the first level (where the target is located). A 2-yard radius would allow you to do that with two "castings" of the Wall, but to do it all in one, you need a 3-yard radius. Basically, you need 13 hexes worth of Wall to do it, and a 2-yard radius only gives you 7. 3 yards gives you 19, so you could use those extra 6 to reinforce the bottom. Of course, I think the Area Effect Enhancement doubles radius with each level (2, 4, 8, 16, etc), so unless you allow for a partial level, you're actually looking at a 4-yard radius, which gives you 18 more hexes*, which would let you do some serious reinforcement.

*ProTip - the number of hexes at a specific distance is equal to 6x(radius-1), with 1 hex at radius 1. So 1 is 1, 2 is 6 (total 7), 3 is 12 (total 19), 4 is 18 (total 37), 5 is 24 (total 61), 6 is 30 (total 91), and so forth.