Disabling a car's engine

[The Colonel]

In my experience, busting the cam belt is an excellent way to make an engine fly all over the place ... and that probably has very little DR indeed, albiet on a very small target.
Likewise the plague of electronic doo-dads that hang off a modern engine...

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by gilbertocarlos

Wait, so with only -3 I can negate a 40 point advantage AND get triple damage?

Basically, yeah. Unliving without No Vitals (and preferably No Brain too) is vulnerable to anyone who can make the called shots.

[starslayer]

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

Basically, yeah. Unliving without No Vitals (and preferably No Brain too) is vulnerable to anyone who can make the called shots.

Dosen't the damage divisor of unliving still apply, just get largely superceded by the wounding multipler?

IE- Impaling does 1/2 damage vs unliving.

Impaling attack to the brain does 3x damage.

Impaling attacks to the brain of an unliving creature does 2x or 1.5x dmage (depending if you do it additively or multiplactively).

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by starslayer

Dosen't the damage divisor of unliving still apply, just get largely superceded by the wounding multipler?

IE- Impaling does 1/2 damage vs unliving.

Impaling attack to the brain does 3x damage.

Impaling attacks to the brain of an unliving creature does 2x or 1.5x dmage (depending if you do it additively or multiplactively).

No. Unliving replaces the wounding factors for certain damage types with different numbers. The brain and vitals hit locations replace the wounding factor for damage type with the hit-location specific wounding factor. There's no modifiers to be combined anywhere in this.

[starslayer]

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

No. Unliving replaces the wounding factors for certain damage types with different numbers. The brain and vitals hit locations replace the wounding factor for damage type with the hit-location specific wounding factor. There's no modifiers to be combined anywhere in this.

Humm, that seems to make unliving a bit to expensive compared to homogenous/diffuse. (Not disputing the way that things break down, just an observation)

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by starslayer

Humm, that seems to make unliving a bit to expensive compared to homogenous/diffuse.

Homogenous should probably be [50], since it includes No Brain and No Vitals for free and also has about twice the effect of Unliving. On the other hand, there is a certain amount of diminishing returns to being extremely resistant to a subset of damage types.

[vierasmarius]

How much of an enhancement would it be to have "Extended" Unliving, that also halves damage taken by the Vitals and Brain (to x1.5 and x2 respectively)? Actually, I guess that's the wrong approach... better to take No Vitals and No Brain, limited so the subject takes half damage instead of removing the locations entirely. I could see that being as much as -50%, putting the whole package (Unliving, half-damage Vitals and Brain) at [25] points. Or maybe slightly less, since those only apply to Piercing and Impaling.

[Nereidalbel]

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

How much of an enhancement would it be to have "Extended" Unliving, that also halves damage taken by the Vitals and Brain (to x1.5 and x2 respectively)? Actually, I guess that's the wrong approach... better to take No Vitals and No Brain, limited so the subject takes half damage instead of removing the locations entirely. I could see that being as much as -50%, putting the whole package (Unliving, half-damage Vitals and Brain) at [25] points. Or maybe slightly less, since those only apply to Piercing and Impaling.

And tight-beam Burning.

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

And tight-beam Burning.

No, I mean that these modified Injury Tolerances only applies to Piercing and Impaling. Tight-Beam Burning still gets x2 damage to the Vitals, and all non-pi/imp attacks get x4 damage to the Brain. The special effects for those hit locations also still apply (mostly extra penalties to Knockdown / Stun).

[Tomsdad]

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

Well, you still have to get through DR, so only triple wounding. But yeah, unless they buy No Vitals and No Brain, the Unliving guy you're shooting at still has weak spots.

Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth

No. Unliving replaces the wounding factors for certain damage types with different numbers. The brain and vitals hit locations replace the wounding factor for damage type with the hit-location specific wounding factor. There's no modifiers to be combined anywhere in this.

while I agree you're right by RAW (or a reasonable interpretation of it), I personally combine both.

Otherwise you get car vitals that are 2x as vital as human vitals (if its hit by P, 3x as vital if it's hit by P- so we're saying compared to the rest of the car engine blocks are more susceptible to damage the smaller the bullet gets?). But a engine block is still made of thick metal*. Not helped by the fact that you probably getting at least a +1 to partially negate the -3 vitals mod due to SM.

That DR5 46HP sedan will be taken to negative HP by on average 4x 9mm pistol rounds using just the vitals x3 mod, but would take 12x 9mm with x1/3 & x3.

But would still be as vulnerable to larger weapons (the Barrett M82A1 in HT will take it negative in one shot, the Steyr-Solothurn S18-1000 will still take it to -2x HP in one shot)

You want to reliably shoot out engine blocks you'll need a big gun to do it with one shot, or a lot of small bullets, I think that's fine.

Now if my player wants to target a fuel line or radiator I'd probably apply some version of bleeding rules!

*I.e yes it's vital but it's still un-living.