06-22-2015, 08:07 PM | #1 |
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: The Land of Enchantment
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Weapon Adaptation [MA]
I have a question on how techniques work with weapon adaptation. Take Glaive Fighting (MA187) as an example, because the idea of combining Staff skill with a duelling bill is awesome.
Let's say I want to be frugal with points, and I want to favor the Staff skill awesomeness, so I only put one point into Polearm but buff Staff really high. Then I take Weapon Adaptation (Polearm to Staff). But I also really like Hook and Sweep attacks. If I have Hook (Polearm) because it's included in the Glaive Fighting style, but I'm mostly using Staff skill to fight with the bill per Weapon Adaptation, do I base by Hook attack off Polearm skill or off of Staff skill? I assume Polearm. (I know, I know, I could just buy Hook (Staff). But that seems less true to the style, or something...) I could Style Adaptation (Polearm and Quarterstaff), but this still doesn't get me Hook (Staff). Or does Weapon Adaptation (Polearm to Staff) allow me to buy Hook (Staff)? Or does Style Adaptation (Polearm and Quarterstaff) allow it? AND THEN, if I do have Hook (Staff), can I use it to hook with the bill??? Last edited by acrosome; 06-22-2015 at 08:21 PM. |
06-22-2015, 09:58 PM | #2 | ||
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: On the road again...
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Re: Weapon Adaptation [MA]
The relevant text of the Perk as relayed in Power-Ups 2: Perks reads:
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What you want for Hook is the Skill Adaptation Perk, the relevant part of which reads: Quote:
And don't feel bad; whenever I'm making these type characters I always have to double-check the differences between Weapon Adaptation, Style Adaptation, Skill Adaptation, and Technique Mastery.
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06-22-2015, 10:06 PM | #3 | ||||
Join Date: Jun 2006
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Re: Weapon Adaptation [MA]
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If your campaign is restricting what techniques you are allowed to improve (the optional rule on Martial Arts p.141), then maybe not. The perks for getting around that are Style and Technique Adaptation. Or Rules Exemption, there are techniques this rule would seem to forbid anyone from ever learning unless the GM invents some new styles or allows an exemption some other way. Honestly this rule is confusingly implemented, it really needed to be made a lot more prominent and the rules for getting around it more clearly marked as irrelevant if you weren't using it. Quote:
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06-23-2015, 10:12 AM | #4 |
GURPS Line Editor
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Montréal, Québec
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Re: Weapon Adaptation [MA]
GURPS Martial Arts, p. 74: "You can learn [Hook] for any Melee Weapon skill, but you’ll need a suitable weapon to use it."
GURPS Martial Arts, p. 214 (or GURPS Low-Tech Companion 2, p. 14): "Any swung weapon [...] can have a small hook to permit use of the Hook technique." A quarterstaff is a swung weapon, so it can have a hook for +$25 and negligible weight. If you want to go nuts and give it a full-on bill head for +$90 ($100 for dueling bill minus $10 for quarterstaff) and +2 lbs. (6 lbs. for dueling bill minus 4 lbs. for quarterstaff), then you've gone above and beyond the call of duty. Go ahead and learn Hook (Staff) to wield it.
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06-23-2015, 07:30 PM | #5 |
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: The Land of Enchantment
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Re: Weapon Adaptation [MA]
My bad- I get that Hook (Staff) is a valid technique. What I'm asking about is more about justifying buying it, and specifically in the setting of these defined MA styles. But the discussion so far has indeed ruled some things out for me, and I have refined my question. To whit:
Hook (Polearm) is a listed technique for the Glaive Fighting style. There is no Hook (Staff) listed under the Quarterstaff style. So if I mix 'em up with Style Adaptation (Glaive Fighting and Quarterstff) does that "justify" allowing the Hook (Staff) technique? So that I can used my highly buffed Staff skill to do the, er, hooking... See what I've come to? I'm hooking, now. I'm one of those purists who likes to invent a neat character story and then build a character to fit it, as opposed to just developing Roland the Optimized Knight, per se. In this case, a character who was low class and grew up learning "peasant weapons" like staff, but was drafted into an army and adapted those skills to his bill. (I adore peasant weapons for some reason.) I know that I can just damned well buy Hook (Staff) if I really want to, but I'm trying to stay true to these styles somehow, if I can. And I'm quite willing to "waste" the points on these various Adaptations and a Polearm skill that I'll never use to do it. Did that make any sense? I'm not the most eloquent at explaining myself. Last edited by acrosome; 06-23-2015 at 07:57 PM. |
06-23-2015, 08:01 PM | #6 | |
Join Date: Jun 2006
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Re: Weapon Adaptation [MA]
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The Style Adaption perk is another one that's not well worded. Taking it lets you add whatever techniques to a style as the GM wants. There's no actual need to reference another style at all, as witnessed by the rules legality of Style Adaptation (All), which turns off the limiting rule entirely for this style.
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06-23-2015, 08:34 PM | #7 |
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: The Land of Enchantment
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Re: Weapon Adaptation [MA]
So... I don't actually need to buy the Glaive Fighting style and waste a point in Polearm skill? I just need to buff up my Quarterstaff style, and then buy Style Adaptation (Quarterstaff to Glaive Fighting) and Weapon Adaptation (Polearm to Staff)? This will justify buying the Hook (Staff) technique?
Interesting. A couple of points saved, if nothing else... So this is valid, and lets me use the buffed Staff skill with a bill?: Style Familiarity (Quarterstaff) Style Adaptation (Quarterstaff to Glaive Fighting) Weapon Adaptation (Polearm to Staff) Grip Mastery (Staff) Staff- at some ridiculous level Hook (Staff)- at whatever level Various other techniques from both Quarterstaff and Glaive Fighting styles Note: SInce that is two non-style perks I need 40 points in Quarterstaff style to justify them, per MA p.49. So, just to pull this off at all, this character has to be Death incarnate with a stick in his hand... Or do I need Style Familiarity (Glaive Fighting) and Wrestling, too? (Frankly, I'm going to get Wrestling anyway, but for the sake of argument?) Frankly, that would seem silly in the setting of Style Adaptation (All), because then it would require Style Familiarity for every known style! So, I assume that it is not required. After all, I'm still fighting "like a quarterstaff guy," albeit with a bill. Last edited by acrosome; 06-23-2015 at 08:42 PM. |
06-23-2015, 09:01 PM | #8 | |
Join Date: Jun 2006
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Re: Weapon Adaptation [MA]
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You need 10 points in Staff to get the Grip Mastery style perk, but the other 30 can be in anything. Indeed you could in principle you could do this with zero points in Staff (OK, 1 point in Staff - you need it to qualify for the Style Familiarity (Quarterstaff), since its a primary skill of the style) and 60 in, say, Crossbow to pay for 3 non-style perks. It's just another one of those places the perk limit rules don't make a lot of sense.
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06-23-2015, 09:02 PM | #9 | |
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: The Land of Enchantment
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Re: Weapon Adaptation [MA]
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