06-05-2018, 12:14 PM | #61 | |
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Re: THS 2120!
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That's not only dubious in my eyes it's viewed as a very slippery slope in US law generally. See some of the commentary on yesterday's bakery case that the Supreme Court decided. Apparently, the main reason that the Court ruled the way it did was that the original forum the case was heard in was not neutral towards the baker's religion. Rather it was actively hostile. Simple neutrality may have avoided SCOTUS' problems with the case. Also, note that if a lower court had been actively hostile to one party's ethnicity or gender or a similar factor the case would not be likely to have gotten as far as it did. So no, I wouldn't give special rights to religious belief and this is one area where i may not be out of the local mainstream.
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Fred Brackin |
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06-05-2018, 12:38 PM | #62 | |
GURPS FAQ Keeper
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyïv, Ukraine
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Re: THS 2120!
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It seems a commonly held and self-evident to large parts of humanity thing that religion is and should be a protected class, while, say, musical preferences and other less 'deep' beliefs are not. Last edited by vicky_molokh; 06-05-2018 at 12:52 PM. |
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06-05-2018, 12:54 PM | #63 | |
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Re: THS 2120!
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Generally though giving religion anything more than a strictly neutral status risks running in to our "no Establishment" clause.
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Fred Brackin |
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06-05-2018, 01:23 PM | #64 | |
GURPS FAQ Keeper
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyïv, Ukraine
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Re: THS 2120!
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06-05-2018, 01:53 PM | #65 |
Hero of Democracy
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: far from the ocean
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Re: THS 2120!
The thing about the rules in toxic memes that rubs me wrong is how easy it is to obtain a "vector". Ethos is everything in a memeplex. A troll on youtube has all the credibility of a troll on youtube. A noted talk show host has great influence over his audience, but will struggle to influence opinions in a non-overlapping sphere. Webcomic artists. Youtubers. Authors. Journalists. Protesters. Preachers. Forumites. Film Directors. Graphic designers. And the folks we talk with.
I think that's the real obstacle to memetics. You can't just buy your way into a position of ethos in a memplex. You've got to build up that ethos. I could see memetics as the scientific way of building up an ethos in a memeplex, but that's really not what's described in the memetic engineering ruleset. As for whether or not these folks can actually influence what people believe, they can certainly effect what people say they believe. And if you only have a bunch of people saying they believe something because they believe the folks around them believe something, welcome to the gem that is civilization.
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Be helpful, not pedantic Worlds Beyond Earth -- my blog Check out the PbP forum! If you don't see a game you'd like, ask me about making one! |
06-05-2018, 01:56 PM | #66 |
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: West Virginia
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Re: THS 2120!
An important aspect of memetics, as written up for THS, is pedagogy. The idea of how the world would be changed if teaching children was basically improved really isn't even touched beyond simply saying memetics radically improves pedagogy.
If you did get a significant improvement in teaching all children, the effects on the arts and sciences would be vast. If nothing else the increase in the pool of practitioners would be a game changer.
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Per Ardua Per Astra! Ancora Imparo |
06-05-2018, 02:15 PM | #67 | |
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Re: THS 2120!
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-- Burma! Last edited by cptbutton; 06-05-2018 at 02:20 PM. Reason: Typo |
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06-05-2018, 09:01 PM | #68 | |
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: New England
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Re: THS 2120!
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Or material science improved by exotic compounds made by engineering them with dark matter. Dark energy spacecraft engines. Sounds pretty woo-woo today, but in 2120--who knows? |
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06-05-2018, 11:14 PM | #69 |
Untagged
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Forest Grove, Beaverton, Oregon
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Re: THS 2120!
With time, regardless of exact intelligence, they may develop more unique cultures and greater demand for autonomy.
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Beware, poor communication skills. No offense intended. If offended, it just means that I failed my writing skill check. |
06-05-2018, 11:37 PM | #70 |
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: West Virginia
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Re: THS 2120!
If the intellect of uplifted animals is truely unique and distinctive, would we truely understand what they desire? They might not have the words for their desires, needs, or aspirations.
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Per Ardua Per Astra! Ancora Imparo |
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