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Old 11-07-2020, 10:21 PM   #41
kirbwarrior
 
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Default Re: [Basic] Catfall, Very Fit and Peripheral Vision Cost

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Originally Posted by Sorenant View Post
Well, at least from the second or third floor depending on the height of each storey. Anything above that is increasingly more dangerous.
But, at least with many modern buildings, you can fall in sets of two to three stories. In effect it lets you climb down in seconds which would take most people minutes to do. You can even just bound down stairways, taking a second to drop a floor.

And that's artificial buildings. Falling down a mountain is usually a combination of small falls adding up to a lot of damage. Being able to fall down 5yds at a time gives basically a super thrilling 'dive' off a mountain. Pits, both intentional or otherwise, can be dropped down.

Mind, this reminds me how Acrobatics and thus Catfall don't take into account of how far a person can jump. Someone with a high jump of 7.5ft (or 8) would be better off taking Super Jump to ignore 5yds of falling. Maybe the Acrobatics check could be based on your high jump in feet (effectively high jump x12) or 75% that to be exactly 5yds for average person?
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While I do not think that GURPS is perfect I do think that it is more balanced than what I am likely to create by GM fiat.
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Old 11-08-2020, 09:40 AM   #42
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Default Re: [Basic] Catfall, Very Fit and Peripheral Vision Cost

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Originally Posted by kirbwarrior View Post
But, at least with many modern buildings, you can fall in sets of two to three stories. In effect it lets you climb down in seconds which would take most people minutes to do. You can even just bound down stairways, taking a second to drop a floor.

And that's artificial buildings. Falling down a mountain is usually a combination of small falls adding up to a lot of damage. Being able to fall down 5yds at a time gives basically a super thrilling 'dive' off a mountain. Pits, both intentional or otherwise, can be dropped down.
Those are somewhat specific situations, usually I think of jumping down from outside of buildings, cliffs or even planes so stairways and sloped mountainsides, but nevertheless it's a good point that I haven't thought before.


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Originally Posted by kirbwarrior View Post
Mind, this reminds me how Acrobatics and thus Catfall don't take into account of how far a person can jump. Someone with a high jump of 7.5ft (or 8) would be better off taking Super Jump to ignore 5yds of falling. Maybe the Acrobatics check could be based on your high jump in feet (effectively high jump x12) or 75% that to be exactly 5yds for average person?
Another good point. The highest vertical jump an average human with Basic Move 5 can make is around 1 yard, so Catfall effectively quintuples the safe falling distance. Keeping this multiplier instead of fixed value would surely make the advantage better for all, including very agile characters (eg a traceurs with Basic Move 8 could jump down 10 yards).
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Old 11-08-2020, 01:04 PM   #43
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Default Re: [Basic] Catfall, Very Fit and Peripheral Vision Cost

A character with Jumping-20 is capable of a high jump of up to 100" and a broad jump of up to 34'.
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Old 11-08-2020, 01:55 PM   #44
Fred Brackin
 
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Default Re: [Basic] Catfall, Very Fit and Peripheral Vision Cost

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A character with Jumping-20 is capable of a high jump of up to 100" and a broad jump of up to 34'.
That's only if you use the rule where you can base jumping distance off 1/2 Jumping Skill and it's an example why you should never, ever do that. An anemic 80-year old with ST 7 and move 1 can jump that far if he keeps his DX-based Jumping Skill up. He can even make "running" high and broad jumps if he takes a 10 yard run-up even though it'll take him 10 seconds to limp that far.

I can make characters with unrealistic jumping distances too but at least they'll be paragons of athletic abilty in other ways.
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Old 11-08-2020, 02:14 PM   #45
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Default Re: [Basic] Catfall, Very Fit and Peripheral Vision Cost

Men's running high jump record is over 8', so Jumping-20 does not produce effects that are far off, though it does produce some exceptionally long results for running broad jump. In either case, it is a standard rule and not an optional rule, so it is fine for the vast majority of campaigns.
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Old 11-08-2020, 02:14 PM   #46
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Default Re: [Basic] Catfall, Very Fit and Peripheral Vision Cost

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A lot of players seem to view Catfall as passive "in case I fall" protection from harm, but I think the key is to make active use of it. Lead pursuing foes to high places, then safely jump down and run away (or start shooting at the foes) as they slowly climb their way down. And use it to jump on foes from above. Even foes that aren't surprised will take a penalty to defense (and will take more damage than you do if you're simply slamming from above).
Yeah, it's important to remember that for 'circumstantial' abilities, it's not only the GM who can influence what circumstances apply. When you have protection from a particular danger that opens up what would normally be really stupid options where you court or outright embrace that danger.

("They can't grab me if I'm on fire.")
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Old 11-08-2020, 02:24 PM   #47
Fred Brackin
 
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Default Re: [Basic] Catfall, Very Fit and Peripheral Vision Cost

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Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl View Post
Men's running high jump record is over 8', so Jumping-20 does not produce effects that are far off, though it does produce some exceptionally long results for running broad jump. In either case, it is a standard rule and not an optional rule, so it is fine for the vast majority of campaigns.
It produces a long jump that's almost 5 full feet beyond the record and official or not it's a place where the rules are broken.

I pointed this out on the old Pyramid boards (probably back in 2004) but I've sort of known it since i got my copy of 1e (1986?) and started making a character who abused this rule back then.
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Old 11-08-2020, 10:57 PM   #48
kirbwarrior
 
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Default Re: [Basic] Catfall, Very Fit and Peripheral Vision Cost

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Originally Posted by Sorenant View Post
Another good point. The highest vertical jump an average human with Basic Move 5 can make is around 1 yard, so Catfall effectively quintuples the safe falling distance. Keeping this multiplier instead of fixed value would surely make the advantage better for all, including very agile characters (eg a traceurs with Basic Move 8 could jump down 10 yards).
Quintuple max high jump sounds great for Acrobatics and Catfall and lines up closely with RAW, plus it lets them always be useful with any level of Super Jump.

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
It produces a long jump that's almost 5 full feet beyond the record and official or not it's a place where the rules are broken.
The rules for jumps I think are just bad in general. Your broad jump seems to get too big, especially compared to high jump. I think it's about x4 high jump which looks really silly when you get extreme numbers. Then again, I also dislike how there are flat modifiers in the equation but I'm not sure what a 'good' fix to that would be.
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While I do not think that GURPS is perfect I do think that it is more balanced than what I am likely to create by GM fiat.
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Old 11-09-2020, 09:20 AM   #49
Michele
 
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Default Re: [Basic] Catfall, Very Fit and Peripheral Vision Cost

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Facinating - Gliding does not actually specify that you can't hover, and 'Cannot Hover' specifically states that it's incompatible with Gliding.
Cannot Hover is not compatible with either form of Gliding because it would be double-dipping. Indeed, you can't hover when you glide.

And yes, while the descriptions of Gliding and Controlled Gliding do not specify you can't hover with those Limitations, please see p. B398. With either form of Gliding, you must move at least 1/4 of your top air speed each turn. Otherwise, you go into a stall and start falling.

I studied the GURPS rules for unpowered flight for "A Whisper in the Sky", Pyramid #3/39.
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