01-23-2019, 05:10 PM | #31 |
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota, U.S.A.
|
Re: Low TL familiarity?
Paying for a separate perk or technique just to access each low-TL version of each of dozens or scores of skills, over multiple TLs, isn't just expensive. It's very tedious.
It also doesn't remove the TL penalties on learning new skills or using low-TL equipment. In other words, it doesn't adequately represent somebody who personally lived through and remembers those TLs. And for entire immortal species, charging for an Unusual Background on top of that doesn't seem reasonable. Wildcard skills can remove TL penalties for what they cover, but it's tricky to get every skill in the game covered by non-overlapping wildcards. Malloyd's Tech Familiarity looks like the most useable suggestion for immortals. They'd still need multiple versions of skills, but it would nonetheless be minimized bookkeeping.
__________________
I have Confused and Clueless. Sometimes I miss sarcasm and humor, or critically fail my Savoir-Faire roll. None of it is intentional. Published GURPS Settings (as of 4/2013 -- I hope to update it someday...) Last edited by Vaevictis Asmadi; 01-23-2019 at 05:30 PM. |
01-23-2019, 05:28 PM | #32 | ||
Join Date: Jul 2008
|
Re: Low TL familiarity?
Quote:
What a perk or technique might do is let you not buy all those many skills. Quote:
You're penalized for using equipment that does not meet the basic standards for the skill you are using it for - a TL6 doctor's bag is fine for Physician/TL6, but for Physician/TL8 it's verging on improvised tools. If you have Physician/TL6 you can use it with that without penalty, but you'll only get Physician/TL6 results.
__________________
I don't know any 3e, so there is no chance that I am talking about 3e rules by accident. |
||
01-23-2019, 05:59 PM | #33 | |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: On the road again...
|
Re: Low TL familiarity?
Quote:
Allow me to expand on what I have for "I Lived It!" Say you took Soldier/TL8 at IQ+2 [8] and I Lived It 7 [7]. That would let you use Soldier/TL1 through Soldier/TL8 at no penalty (because you've been kept up with things from, say, being an Achaean or Akkadian spearman through being a soldier in the current Middle East conflicts). If your TL is 11, as in William's case, and you have Electronics Operation/TL11 (Communications) IQ+1 [4], and you've got I Lived It! 3 [3], you can use ElecOps (Comms)/TL10, ElecOps (Comms)/TL9, or ElecOps (Comms)/TL8, with no penalty. Buying those separately up to IQ+1 would be the expensive part. Clear as mud?
__________________
"Life ... is an Oreo cookie." - J'onn J'onzz, 1991 "But mom, I don't wanna go back in the dungeon!" The GURPS Marvel Universe Reboot Project A-G, H-R, and S-Z, and its not-a-wiki-really web adaptation. Ranoc, a Muskets-and-Magery Renaissance Fantasy Setting |
|
01-23-2019, 06:08 PM | #34 | |
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota, U.S.A.
|
Re: Low TL familiarity?
I'm afraid I'm pretty confused by this. I thought the TL rules make it that you can only learn skills from your own TL, not any other TL.
And I'm not really following the perk and technique suggestions. Do you have to buy them separately for each skill, or just once per TL? Phantasm when you say "at no penalty," do you mean Attribute+0 ? Quote:
You might think there'd be no point to trying to learn a lower TL skill, but say you're a blacksmith and you're stranded in the wilderness with no knife or axe, and no forge. Can you knap a decent stone knife or axe? Say you're trying to use equipment from a lower TL because that's all you have available... while picking a lock, setting a broken bone, or repairing a car.
__________________
I have Confused and Clueless. Sometimes I miss sarcasm and humor, or critically fail my Savoir-Faire roll. None of it is intentional. Published GURPS Settings (as of 4/2013 -- I hope to update it someday...) Last edited by Vaevictis Asmadi; 01-23-2019 at 06:15 PM. |
|
01-23-2019, 06:24 PM | #35 | |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: On the road again...
|
Re: Low TL familiarity?
Quote:
The Low TL disadvantage means you can't buy above a certain level, and the High TL advantage means you can buy up. You don't need anything special to buy your skills at a lower TL, because someone can probably still teach you (or you can self-teach with the right manuals). And what I mean by "no penalty" in regards to the perk is: if you know Skill/TL8 at IQ+2 and I Lived It! 3, you can use Skill/TL5-7 at IQ+2 without having to buy the lower levels of the skill separately. Clear as mud?
__________________
"Life ... is an Oreo cookie." - J'onn J'onzz, 1991 "But mom, I don't wanna go back in the dungeon!" The GURPS Marvel Universe Reboot Project A-G, H-R, and S-Z, and its not-a-wiki-really web adaptation. Ranoc, a Muskets-and-Magery Renaissance Fantasy Setting |
|
01-23-2019, 06:32 PM | #36 | |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
|
Re: Low TL familiarity?
Quote:
The Basic Set says explicitly that you can learn skills at your TL or lower. What you can't do is learn skills at higher TLs. So if you're a present day character, you can learn TL0-8 skills, but not TL9+. If you have High TL 1, you can learn TL0-9. If you have Low TL 1, you can learn TL0-7. And so on. You don't have to pay points for the ability to learn skills for a TL lower than yours. I have suggested, and some other people have, that there are cases where you might not be able to learn a lower TL skill, because it has fallen into disuse, and the equipment and the textbooks or manuals for it are gone. That's not in the rules as written, but it seems like a reasonable "reality testing" thing. If you have that issue, you might want to have something that lets you learn a skill that ordinary people can't learn. It might be an advantage, or a perk, or a technique. My suggestion was that it's comparable to Reawakened, which also lets you learn things that are unavailable to normal people in your setting, because you remember it from a past life; and since Reawakened is a specialized Unusual Background, other rationales for learning archaic skills could be defined as UBs also. The suggestion that you do it with Anachronistic Skill is the result of not reading the definition of that perk carefully. In the first place, Anachronistic Skill lets you learn a skill that does not yet exist at your TL; for example, it lets you learn Meteorology or Pharmacy (Synthetic) or Physician at TL4 (in the RAW, they aren't available until TL5). But the skill you learn is a version of that skill that fits your actual TL: you learn, say, Pharmacy (Synthetic)/TL4, which otherwise does not exist, rather than Pharmacy (Synthetic)/TL5. Likewise, someone like Ada Lovelace would have Computer Programming/TL5, not /TL7, which is when computer programming came into being as an organized activity in the real world; she would be able to write code for an analytical engine but not for an IBM computer. But this doesn't get you access to a skill at a different TL, whether it's Engineering (Nanomechanisms)/TL10 or Machinist/TL0. In the second place, Anachronistic Skill is described both in Low-Tech and in Powers: The Weird as a perk that lets you learn skills BEFORE THEIR TIME, not after they've been forgotten. Ordinarily, you wouldn't even need it; you could just learn the low-tech skill. If you made up a perk that let you learn just one otherwise lost skill from a lower TL, it would cause less confusion if it had a different name. On the other hand, you could just take the UB and have access to as many forgotten arts as the GM would hold still for.
__________________
Bill Stoddard I don't think we're in Oz any more. |
|
01-23-2019, 06:47 PM | #37 |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: On the road again...
|
Re: Low TL familiarity?
I must note that my suggested "I Lived It!" Perk is a house rule I use, not RAW.
__________________
"Life ... is an Oreo cookie." - J'onn J'onzz, 1991 "But mom, I don't wanna go back in the dungeon!" The GURPS Marvel Universe Reboot Project A-G, H-R, and S-Z, and its not-a-wiki-really web adaptation. Ranoc, a Muskets-and-Magery Renaissance Fantasy Setting |
01-23-2019, 06:59 PM | #38 |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
|
Re: Low TL familiarity?
Sure. That's why I didn't comment on it at all.
__________________
Bill Stoddard I don't think we're in Oz any more. |
01-23-2019, 07:02 PM | #39 | ||
Join Date: Jul 2008
|
Re: Low TL familiarity?
Quote:
Learning from default rarely relevant to begin with and TL penalties don't relate to it in any way I can see. Quote:
Though the obsolete equipment is a mixed bag. "Obsolete" bonesetting equipment for a simple fracture might be little different from modern emergency kit, warranting a small penalty at most. For picking a lock or repairing a car, the tech level of your tools is less likely to be a problem than the tech level of the lock. EDIT: That is, if you're using outdated tools on a modern target, or vice-versa, the problem of you knowing what to do may take second place to simply not being able to get there from here. TL4 thieves tools probably won't even fit into modern key locks, never mind electronic locks, and you simply can't fix an engine control computer problem with a wrench or a cracked axle with a workshop for retuning grav-car drives...
__________________
I don't know any 3e, so there is no chance that I am talking about 3e rules by accident. Last edited by Ulzgoroth; 01-23-2019 at 07:12 PM. |
||
01-23-2019, 07:05 PM | #40 |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Portsmouth, VA, USA
|
Re: Low TL familiarity?
I turned it into a wildcard technique myself. It applies to all skills usable at a lower TL, bundled that with a 1 point UB then made a new advantage for 4/level. Works decently enough.
__________________
My Twitter My w23 Stuff My Blog Latest GURPS Book: Dungeon Fantasy Denizens: Thieves Latest TFT Book: The Sunken Library Become a Patron! |
Tags |
anachronistic skill, anachronistic training, tech level penalties, technological skills |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|