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Old 02-15-2018, 04:13 PM   #1
scc
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Default [DF] Magery And Effect And Healing Spells

OK, a post in my thread about converting GURPS to a computer game about the -3 per use that healing spells suffer got me thinking about ways around it.

The simplest is to buy a Healing Wand, a wand that allows you to cast one (or more) of the healing spells and have everyone in the party take sufficient ranks in Physician/Esoteric Medicine to be able to use it (Note too sure how that works in DF)

But there's one question remaining, Wizards and Magery and Magery and Effect. If a Wizard has sufficient levels of Magery that Magery and Effect would apply (4 or more) does it apply? This would technically be an object with a Divine or Drudic power source/supernatural origin so it probably shouldn't, but I want to hear people's thoughts.
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Old 02-15-2018, 04:28 PM   #2
David Johnston2
 
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Default Re: [DF] Magery And Effect And Healing Spells

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Originally Posted by scc View Post
OK, a post in my thread about converting GURPS to a computer game about the -3 per use that healing spells suffer got me thinking about ways around it.

The simplest is to buy a Healing Wand, a wand that allows you to cast one (or more) of the healing spells and have everyone in the party take sufficient ranks in Physician/Esoteric Medicine to be able to use it (Note too sure how that works in DF)

But there's one question remaining, Wizards and Magery and Magery and Effect. If a Wizard has sufficient levels of Magery that Magery and Effect would apply (4 or more) does it apply? This would technically be an object with a Divine or Drudic power source/supernatural origin so it probably shouldn't, but I want to hear people's thoughts.
I house ruled that there's a -3 for each healing spell regardless of who casts it.
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Old 02-15-2018, 04:47 PM   #3
Anthony
 
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Default Re: [DF] Magery And Effect And Healing Spells

I would count a wand as the caster, so the wand would be at -3 per retry (though you could use different wands).
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Old 02-15-2018, 04:53 PM   #4
scc
 
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Default Re: [DF] Magery And Effect And Healing Spells

Wow guys, way to completely miss the question, which is: Does Magery count for determining how many hit points I can heal?
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Old 02-15-2018, 04:58 PM   #5
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Default Re: [DF] Magery And Effect And Healing Spells

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Wow guys, way to completely miss the question, which is: Does Magery count for determining how many hit points I can heal?
Ah. No. It might count if the item used a magery-based power source (rules unclear), but it certainly doesn't apply for druidic or divine items.
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Old 02-15-2018, 04:59 PM   #6
AlexanderHowl
 
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Default Re: [DF] Magery And Effect And Healing Spells

No, not by RAW, but Wizards cannot use healing magic in DF, so it is a moot point anyway.
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Old 02-15-2018, 07:21 PM   #7
scc
 
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Default Re: [DF] Magery And Effect And Healing Spells

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No, not by RAW, but Wizards cannot use healing magic in DF, so it is a moot point anyway.
The thing is Magic it says that if you have 15 or more in Physician you can use a Wand of Minor/Major Healing (Or whatever). Presumably this still applies in DF, except that you replace Physician with Esoteric Medicine. So a Wizard with Esoteric Medicine-15 can use can use a Wand of Minor Healing, now for Magery and Effect does the Wizard's Magery count for allow him to spend more then 3 FP when casting the spell?

Do note that this isn't an isolated problem, this is simply probably the most obvious case and the one that came to me first, it applies to ANY spell in Magic that has an item entry, no Magery requirement to use said item, the spells mechanics mean Magery and effect apply to the spell, and it's on some but not all of the DF class spell lists.
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Old 02-15-2018, 07:54 PM   #8
David Johnston2
 
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Default Re: [DF] Magery And Effect And Healing Spells

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The thing is Magic it says that if you have 15 or more in Physician you can use a Wand of Minor/Major Healing (Or whatever). Presumably this still applies in DF, except that you replace Physician with Esoteric Medicine. So a Wizard with Esoteric Medicine-15 can use can use a Wand of Minor Healing, now for Magery and Effect does the Wizard's Magery count for allow him to spend more then 3 FP when casting the spell?
Magery wouldn't interact with a different power source at all. Mage with a holy item would be like any other member of the faithful or unbeliever as applies.
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Old 02-16-2018, 07:50 AM   #9
wmervine4
 
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Default Re: [DF] Magery And Effect And Healing Spells

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Originally Posted by scc View Post
The thing is Magic it says that if you have 15 or more in Physician you can use a Wand of Minor/Major Healing (Or whatever). Presumably this still applies in DF, except that you replace Physician with Esoteric Medicine. So a Wizard with Esoteric Medicine-15 can use can use a Wand of Minor Healing, now for Magery and Effect does the Wizard's Magery count for allow him to spend more then 3 FP when casting the spell?
My interpretation here is that the text in Magic is explicit about only being able to spend between 1 and 3 energy on Minor Healing. Unlike other spells such as Fireball and Explosive Lightning that mention Magery level, Minor and Major Healing are both explicit about the energy amounts allowed by the spell, and it is not related to Magery level. By a strict reading, I'd say 3 FP is the max you could use with Minor Healing.

I admit, however, that this could have just been an oversight in the editing process and all spells were really intended to be tied to Magery level rather than explicit caps on energy expenditure. I didn't write it though, so I can't say for sure. :-)

I've also questioned the bit about who is really casting the spell when using an item. I gave out a wand of Minor Healing in my game early on and have been saying that whoever is wielding it is essentially the caster, so if one mage uses it to cast Minor Healing, then hands it to the other mage, the -3 for cumulative castings doesn't apply. I could also see an argument for saying the wand itself is its own caster, so it doesn't matter who uses it. Whenever anyone is healed by the wand, cumulative heals with that specific wand are at -3. I've been playing it the first way, but I can see the logic behind the second interpretation. If there is an official interpretation on this, I'd like to hear it.
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Old 02-16-2018, 11:05 AM   #10
sir_pudding
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Default Re: [DF] Magery And Effect And Healing Spells

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I admit, however, that this could have just been an oversight in the editing process and all spells were really intended to be tied to Magery level rather than explicit caps on energy expenditure. I didn't write it though, so I can't say for sure. :-)
The intent of Magery and Effect is that they are, it explicitly says that higher Magery allows you to exceed the minimum limits.

That doesn't mean that Magery can substitute for a different source talent though, but that the appropriate talent can use the same rule. Magery 6 is irrelevant for Minor Healing in games where healing spells are not wizardly but Power Investiture 6 means you can put up to six points in healing spells granted by your god.
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