08-13-2022, 10:35 PM | #81 | ||
Join Date: Jun 2013
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Re: Costs in GURPS dollars
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I mean, there arguably needs to be some sort of money sink to explain why Novice Delvers ([62]) and Veteran Delvers ([250]) start with the same amount of gear, despite the latter likely having spent a good deal of time delving ruins for riches.
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08-14-2022, 03:23 AM | #82 | ||
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Re: Costs in GURPS dollars
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Heck, you could still cast level 1 spells if you wanted to — or if you forgot to switch out the old level on your hotbar which I tended to do; the automation of that process was a big quality of life improvement. Quote:
I should mention there are other reasons why Veteran Delvers may not improve their financial situation besides money sinks. The most obviously one is also from D&D1e — the amount of wealth monsters have is very low compared to what is needed to level up but it pays better than what the adventurer could make otherwise. A little computer game called "Majesty: The Fantasy Kingdom Sim" (2000) gave a reason why adventurers would do anything if the monster pay outs were so meager — it was not for the wealth the monsters infesting your lands had but for the bounties you as ruler put on them. As ruler you taxed the guilds and provided consumables to the adventures as well as the option to get better gear. Heck, WoW used and still uses this — early on creatures at best provide materials for potions and making of equipment while it is the reward for the bounties (quests) that really motivate you. Ironically I so power leveled my crafting skills that if not for the level requirements of gear my characters would have been wearing better gear then they could have gotten in early dungeons and certainly what I was getting from quests. This brings up another reason the Filth Rich or even wealthier would go dungeoneering — get better gear than can be made in a reasonable amount of time by the locals. Perhaps it is the only place to get very powerful gear (given how long magic items by default Magic rules take to make) For example, the Staff of the Magi in D&D1e has 19 castable spells and what amounts to Magic Resistance +2. The chance the item would survive this is an 11 on a 3d6 (62.5%), not the best odds given the amount of time it would take for a lone mage to make. While the Staff of the Magi could be built with via the Magic Items as Advantages (Knacks) method, one is still talking about a minimum of 267 points for the spells (before the various Gadget modifiers) or a totally insane 6,675 mage-days (267 points at 200/hr per point and assuming 8 hour working days). If you want one then better to see if you can find one in a dungeon than sit around a minimum of 3 years with only a 62.5% you will even get the item at the end of it. All moderately to powerful gear is like that and do you really want to risk someone else getting this insanely rare item?
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08-14-2022, 05:59 AM | #83 | ||
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ronkonkoma, NY
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Re: Costs in GURPS dollars
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And even if you want to cause inflation in your campaign, that won't change what you can buy with GURPS $. GURPS $ always remains fixed. What changes is the local currency. In a fantasy campaign experiencing severe inflation, $1 might start out equal one silver coin or one-twentieth of a gold coin, but after inflation hits $1 equals one gold coin. That product you previously bought for one silver coin ($1) now costs one gold coin ($1). The amount of money you possess (in gold and silver) doesn't change, but their worth in GURPS $ does. |
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08-14-2022, 06:22 AM | #84 | |||||
Join Date: Jun 2013
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Re: Costs in GURPS dollars
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The issue with that, of course, is that your delvers basically stop living that way as soon as the players come into the picture, as they accumulate magic items (and wealth, although the latter may well find itself being spent on magic items and consumables) rather than blowing it all on wild parties and the like. And this is basically playing the game as intended. Quote:
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Of course, unless the item cannot be made, someone who is Filthy Rich or wealthier is in a position to be able to commission someone to do the job for them.
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08-14-2022, 06:35 AM | #85 | |
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Location: Sumter, SC
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Re: Costs in GURPS dollars
Then why have things like Realm Management? :-)
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But in a magical world with things like the Food College exist food (including "corn") can be insanely cheap. Create Food (2 per meal for organic, 30 seconds) and Essential Food (3 per meal for organic, 30 seconds) are cheap in terms of casting and if you can use ceremonial casting things get totally ridiculous.
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08-14-2022, 07:55 AM | #86 | ||||
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ronkonkoma, NY
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Re: Costs in GURPS dollars
Paragraph three of GURPS Ream Management, with my own emphasis:
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But the existence of the Create Food spell will only affect food prices if the GM wants it to. If the GM would rather have ordinary food prices coexisting with the Create Food spell, then they do. There's no supply and demand behind all this; you just make up what you want. Quote:
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08-14-2022, 11:48 AM | #87 | |||
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Re: Costs in GURPS dollars
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5e DMG fixed much of that silliness and it actual gives us a indication in how much gold is actual in a gp — "A 5-pound gold bar is worth 250 gp" (pg 20) This isn't to far off from the leopard coin (1344 at 23 k) which was ~25 mm in diameter which is the same diameter as a Half Eagle $5 (Turban Head) which was .9167 fine (1795-1834) and clocked in at ~1/52 lb. The only thing gonzo is the conversion rate between gold, silver, and copper D&D gives: 1 lb of gold = 10 lb of silver (5e DMG pg 20) The thing is gold was insanely valuable by even by modern standards supposedly ~$US 3000 adjusted for inflation and topping out around 1492 where it started to decline in value never hitting that zenith again. A more proper ratio would have been about 200 copper coins = 20 Silver coins = 1 gold coin (and that is fudging things like crazy to keep the math sane as 36 sp to 1 gp was more in line with reality.)
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08-16-2022, 12:39 PM | #88 |
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Brazil
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Re: Costs in GURPS dollars
Indeed, Gurps "dollar" ($) is NOT inflationary. Prices may be rising in the market, but Gurps $ does NOT reflect that. Lets say that a group of adventures earned $1000 "Gurps dollars" in a dungeon. And that, in the setting currency, this is the same as "1000 gp (gold points, local currency)". And lets say that this double the amount of currency in the village they dumped that all out.
So, after a week they hit the dungeon again. They earn another $1000 (Gurps dollars), and yet the prices for the adventures remains the same (in Gurps dollars). If you wanna say that there is inflation, fine, there is inflation - but that's in the setting currency (gold points), NOT in Gurps dollars. This means that the adventures have actually earned 2000 gp this time - which by the "new cotation" is worthed $1000 just the same. Since I highly doubt any one is willing to constantly do math around DF's "bitcoin" (gurps dollar) and yet another fictious currency for a fictious world, you just take things at face value and do not bother about it. If you do wanna play "Gurps DF: accountability sciences" however, go ahead and do it, but it's important to say that Gurps $ doesnt require this to properly function |
08-16-2022, 12:55 PM | #89 |
Join Date: Jun 2013
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Re: Costs in GURPS dollars
Eh, while the GURPS $ isn't inflationary, and is meant to represent the same value in any campaign, that's more a "between campaigns" kind of thing, a good starting point. If you decide the actions of the PC's has resulted in 20% inflation locally, it's a lot easier to just increase the prices in GURPS $ than decrease the value of their coin, in no small part because once the characters leave the local area that is seeing inflation due to the bags of filthy lucre the PC's have brought in, prices are going to go back down to normal, which would mean having to recalculate the worth of their coin again. Just saying "prices are 20% higher here, because of inflation," and then charging $1.20 GURPS for a loaf of bread, will work out a lot better, with a lot less headache than "Due to inflation, each copper farthing is now worth $0.83, each silver penny is now worth $3.33, and each gold piece is now worth $66.67."
Naturally, each group/GM can handle things how they see fit.
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08-16-2022, 07:56 PM | #90 | ||
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Re: Costs in GURPS dollars
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There is a little piece regarding "Controlling Inflation" in the Basic Set and it suggests make expensive things (ships, noble titles, etc) available and options of getting involved in long-term, high-risk ventures — though if the average adventurer has a 'live for today because tomorrow you may be worm food' mentality that last option is effectively out the window.
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