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Old 03-15-2019, 12:16 PM   #11
Black Leviathan
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Default Re: "you stumble"

I think it's a case of actions not always fitting into 1 second blocks perfectly. You stumble during your turn but maybe your ungainly fall doesn't happen entirely in the 1 second of your action. Regardless you're going to end up over there and you're going to miss.
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Old 03-15-2019, 09:15 PM   #12
Plane
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Default Re: "you stumble"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gef View Post
Sort of. Check out Martial Arts, p. 107, the "Flying Attack" option under Move and Attack. Basically, you run your full distance, then jump. In a non-cinematic campaign, you get half your out-of-combat running jump distance, which is equal to your out-of-combat standing jump distance, which is (2×MV-3)/3 yards, or 2 yards for MV 5.
Flying attack I believe is an even greater penalty than a normal move and attack (-5 instead of -4) which could increase the likelihood of critical failure...

So far as I understand, wouldn't you move you full distance, make the jump, THEN make the attack roll? At which point if you got the "you stumble" crit fail, you'd get even more distance on top of it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tbone View Post
Another easy way to rule it:

If you have enough remaining Move points to stumble past your opponent, per the text, then you do.

If you don't have the remaining Move points to do so, you just stumble and get turned around within your current hex.
In most situations, people will be making basic Attack maneuvers and be limited to 1 step anyway, which they will often have taken before making their attack, so that would be a way of nullifying that result entirely.

That has a little too much benefit, since part of the problem is that you have given your opponent your back, so I like the idea of ignoring the extra steps and just spinning in a random direction.

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Originally Posted by RyanW View Post
I would be tempted to just say a stumble critical result on a Move and Attack is a fall instead. When people start to look at critical failure tables as a source of special abilities...
There are already fall results so it might get boring to lump it in with that.

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Originally Posted by Black Leviathan View Post
I think it's a case of actions not always fitting into 1 second blocks perfectly. You stumble during your turn but maybe your ungainly fall doesn't happen entirely in the 1 second of your action. Regardless you're going to end up over there and you're going to miss.
Missing happens regardless of what you roll on the crit table, the question is at what point you begin to relocate yourself.

Azagthoth I think had the most workable solution: treating the forcibly steps past the enemy as something you must resolve the following turn (similar to how another result forces a Do Nothing on the next turn, almost like being stunned)

I would say it forces you to take a Move maneuver but only use it to walk past the enemy (you MUST try to evade them) and then stop in the hex behind them...

But conceptually it seems weird you would TRY to evade when you're actually accidentally stumbling past. Which is why I figure treat it as skill 3 so you're not likely to win a contest if opposed, but you will win automatically if unopposed.
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Old 03-16-2019, 01:34 PM   #13
Gef
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Yucca Valley, CA
Default Re: "you stumble"

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Originally Posted by Plane View Post
So far as I understand, wouldn't you move you full distance, make the jump, THEN make the attack roll? At which point if you got the "you stumble" crit fail, you'd get even more distance on top of it?
Sure, you'd accidentally manage to get the full distance you'd have gotten from an out-of-combat jump, but you'd wind up in a compromised position, just as you normally would in a non-combat jump, which is why you weren't going for that in the first place.
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Old 03-16-2019, 04:42 PM   #14
Bicorn
 
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Default Re: "you stumble"

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Originally Posted by Plane View Post
Could we design a technique where in exchange for a penalty, you gain the benefit of, if it crit-failed, being able to shift a critical miss result 1 point in a desired direction post-roll?
I don't feel any ability that relies on the crit-failure table always being used is very good design style. As a GM I treat those tables as just a suggestion rather than a fundamental part of the system.
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Old 03-16-2019, 05:30 PM   #15
PTTG
 
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Join Date: Feb 2011
Default Re: "you stumble"

If you want to choose your dice roll, use some form of Super Luck. Happening to stumble past the enemy in the rare, rare case that's useful is an appropriately Super Luck-y thing to do.
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Old 03-17-2019, 04:47 AM   #16
Gef
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Yucca Valley, CA
Default Re: "you stumble"

Super Luck (Only to Stumble -80%) is just 20 points!

But you could get MV +4 for the same price
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Old 03-18-2019, 08:09 AM   #17
Purple Snit
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Default Re: "you stumble"

Trying to get an advantage out of a Critical Failure Table result is pretty much the definition of Munchkinism. The point of the roll is, you miss badly enough that you are at a severe disadvantage and have your back to your foe. There shouldn't be a way to get something useful out of this! If you want more move, buy more move. But failure is failure; would you suggest a Critical Miss Table result for a spell should actually give you extra fatigue, or more dice of effect? Points for creativity, but I don't think it's a good idea to try to change failure into success or advantage.
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Old 03-23-2019, 10:10 AM   #18
Plane
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Default Re: "you stumble"

The point is that as-is there is a potential advantage to it, unless you change it to something like "you must take a Move on your next Maneuver and try to evade past him and keep your back turned to him" rather than giving a free evade/step on your present turn. Without doing that, may as well allow trading attacks for "2 steps in a straight line past your attacker without being able to turn at the end"
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