Questions on Converting a game to GURPS

[Wendell_Burke]

Hello!

I'm new here and have played gurps only once, but it was with someone who was really good at running it and I've really come to appreciate the system! To that end, I'm trying to understand how one can convert a game to the Gurps system? I mean, I'm sure can just start making approximations, but it seems like there should be some sort of system or book on how to go about it. Is there? If not, how do you structure all of that information? And what if you want to make changes from the original system? How does this affect game balance?

For example, I really like the world of the Dresden Files! I recently got the books as I have had no previous experience with the Fate system. In short, while I think the Aspect thing is neat, I really don't care for how abbreviated character creation is. I'd like a system where there's a significant starting allotment for skills in order to have some more wiggle room to paint a more detailed picture of a starting character (Significantly more than in the Fate system), however, I'd like to keep the character as a beginning character so as to enjoy the gradual increase in experience from play. This isn't about making the character very powerful at the beginning. It's about the character having enough ways, outside of just powers and combat skills, to express a fleshed out and well rounded starting character. So, how does one go about converting a system to Gurps with alterations in mind, while also keeping it balanced and playable?

Thanks!

[Maz]

Welcome!

I only have passing knowledge of the Dresden file (read the first book) and only played a few games with the FATE system.

But! I can still give some advice.

First off. "Balance" is never something fixed. Even in systems such as D&D where they really try to enforce it with "level" and so on... you still do not get balance. An in GURPS "point total" will never be an indicator of power-level and can't be used for balance. Instead you have to look for ways to make each character shine at different times.



As for converting from one system to another. Well The Dresden file RPG is already a conversion from a piece of fiction. It is already cutting corners and forcing the setting to fit with it's rules set. So, don't try to stick too strictly to the rules in the other RPG game. Instead try to convert the feel of the setting to GURPS. This becomes easier the more familiar with the system you become.

---

So first off I would suggest you look at what sort of characters you want the players to be and create some with them. If you don't have players right now but what to play around with the setting you could make templates. Like a set of skill and advantage suggestions for a "journalist" or "mystic" or "witch" or whatever.

[Refplace]

There are no official conversion rules for legal reasons but there are unofficial ones for some systems. However I wouldn't bother.
Go for the feel of the game (or books), not a direct conversion and it will be easier on you and a better fit.
One of the bloggers did the Vampires so maybe they will see this thread. If not post a thread asking about it in the thread title.
A thread can easily scroll to page 2 in a day or so so good titling is important.
Monster Hunters might be a good fit for you, certainly the Ritual Path Magic system introduced there and later got its own book is a nice fit to the magic in the Dresden books. I might tweak it a little if I wanted a closer fit.

[Ulzgoroth]

I think Sorcery (or even straight-up powers) might be better for a lot of the basic (but powerful) stuff Harry throws around like party favors.

The Dresden Files RPG has somewhat separate magic systems for the quick throwing-energy-around stuff and the fancy complicated rituals, IIRC. Following suit in that respect might not be bad.

[tshiggins]

The Dresden Files are an inspiration (along with Supernatural, and even a smattering of Buffy/Angel and Sliders...) for my Facets campaign. You might want to pick up GURPS: Cabal to help you flesh out the setting -- even if only to spark some ideas.

Generally (and very roughly) speaking, 125 points makes for a good starting character in a modern-day wainscot fantasy setting -- which describes Dresden's Chicago, pretty well. As an experienced combat mage with a high IQ and detective skills (including decent contacts), and a potent ally (Bob), Harry may come in at more than that -- even with the brutal disads he had at the start of the series (in GURPS terms, he spent the first couple of books buying them off).

That said 125 points is probably about right for Karrin Murphy and the members of her unit, though, and that's about where you should aim. At 125 points, a 4e GURPS character would make a pretty good member of a team in the pilot episode of an action/adventure TV show -- good stats, a couple of nice advantages, some manageable disads, three or four skills at 13 or 14 to reflect his or her profession, a few at 11 or 12 to indicate (more or less) useful outside or extracurricular interests, and a couple dozen "life skills" and bits and bobs at levels of 8-10 for stuff the character has "picked up" along the way.

The default selection for most characters should be TL 8 skills, unless they can justify something different (admittedly, not that hard in the Dresden Files). Fairies (even the pizza sprites) should cost much more than 125 points, so as to reflect their wide range of capabilities.

It's best to have the players jot down some notes about the characters they'd like to play, so you and they have some guidelines to work with. That also gives you the ability to edit (or even nix, outright) at the inception stage anything that doesn't fit with your campaign concept.

[Wendell_Burke]

Maz: Thanks for the welcome! I get what you're saying about balance being subjective. Very true. Your point about building right from the original fiction is a good one for me. My tendency is to adhere to whatever canon or standard has already been established, but sometimes using someone else's interpretation doesn't work for me. I have to remind myself of that from time to time.

Refplace: So you think it would be easier for me to work from the already established system. Because they have already define and categorized things like powers, skills, etc.? That's why that was my initial thought. Thanks for the book suggestions! Are those all 4th edition? If not, are the earlier editions that weren't made to 4th ed going to work fairly easy with the other 4th ed books?

Ulzgoroth: Thanks! I'll keep that in mind!

tshiggins: Gurps Cabal? I've never even heard of that book. I'll put it on my list. "modern-day wainscot fantasy setting" What setting book is this in, please? I'd like to look into it. Thanks for all of this technical input! I'm still trying to gauge what the numbers mean for each stat. I always liked the old Classic Marvel Superheroes RPG by TSR and how the system gave you a description of what each rank equates to. I'm sure Gurps has that in one of the books. I'll have to find it. I wish I had a group ready to play, but I don't. I've always been particular about the games I play, focused games being my preference, but maybe something will work out in the future. I figure for now, I may as well learn the system better and see if I can put together my own guidelines for the Dresden Files in case I ever get the opportunity to play it. <:)

[Anaraxes]

To my mind, Dresden Files magic is probably best handled by including both magic-as-powers (built out of Advantages, like GURPS Sorcery / Powers / Supers) to represent Evocation, with Ritual Path Magic to represent thaumaturgy. That's probably a lot to absorb all at once.

(If you wanted to leave one out for now, I'd just handle thaumaturgy narratively, much like in Fate, and don't worry about character points for it -- maybe a placeholder Ritual Adept advantage until you get more familiar with the system. In the books, Harry's most often using ritual magic as a plot device anyway.)

And what if you want to make changes from the original system? How does this affect game balance?

GURPS attracts people that want to tinker with the system and adjust things to suit their intended game. The slogan is "GURPS is a toolkit". You're expected to pick and choose and tweak, and you'd hardly ever use all of it at once. I'm not sure _anyone_ here plays GURPS according to a strict literal interpretation of RAW, up to and including SJG staff like Kromm (Sean Punch).

The forum is full of debates over balance, so you'll have plenty of company in discussing whatever questions you come up with.

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by Wendell_Burke

Refplace: So you think it would be easier for me to work from the already established system. Because they have already define and categorized things like powers, skills, etc.? That's why that was my initial thought. Thanks for the book suggestions! Are those all 4th edition? If not, are the earlier editions that weren't made to 4th ed going to work fairly easy with the other 4th ed books?

Yes, my suggestions are Fourth Edition books, GURPS Cabal is Third Edition and would be good background flavor but I would not make it a priority.
Are you basing the campaign off the book series, the tv show, or the game?
I dont know the game so no help there but I read all the books and watched the TV series (not that great).
I will disagree with those recommending Sorcery. That gives too much flexibility for the setting. RPM plus powers I agree with but they would be individual powers, probably with alternative ability mechanics to make them cheaper.

Also for Hellfire I would consider the Soul stuff from a Pyramid issue. But hold off till your more familiar with the system.

[Wendell_Burke]

Anaraxes: I've actually never been one for tinkering with the systems much. Just for the stuff that I think really needs to be fixed, but with this situation, I really like the game world. I just really don't care for Fate as I read it in the game books. I prefer to play in actor-stance and enjoy developing my characters with subtle nuance and lots of detail. It's why Gurps appealed to me. I'd much rather have a system that maybe requires a little more effort on my part, but allows me to create all of that detail and have it matter through the mechanics to some significant degree. It'll be a fun project to get into the books and see how well I can reconstruct the game world and characters. While I'm concerned with building a game that works well and keeps power creep very much in check, I'm not that concerned with 'balance' in the equality sense of the word. There are all sorts of different kinds of characters in Dresden and I can see different ones getting different point allotments. I'm fine with that though I'd like to keep them relatively on the same or similar planes so no one is dwarfed in their ability to affect things and do stuff. I like when you play a game and can encounter very different entities. I always tell my players, 'sometimes you'll meet an npc that you can crush, sometimes he'll be able to crush you, and sometimes it'll be a tough call, just like life. Choose carefully.' <:)

Refplace: I haven't decided what material I was going to use for the conversion/ creation, but I have a bunch of the audiobooks and the dvds and think that would be a good start. Maybe the game books can help in how they generally broke down things, but I wouldn't be trying to emulate that system.

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by Wendell_Burke

Refplace: I haven't decided what material I was going to use for the conversion/ creation, but I have a bunch of the audiobooks and the dvds and think that would be a good start. Maybe the game books can help in how they generally broke down things, but I wouldn't be trying to emulate that system.

Yeah the books are howI would do it, great setting.
Here is a link to a blog that did some work for you.
http://www.rigilkent-online.com/Blog...ourt-vampires/

And a thread here
http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=136383