01-16-2018, 03:59 PM | #1 |
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Italy, Rome
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technical grappling, whole body CP and dodge malus
hi everyone!!
Asking for your help about control points and the malus they deal to dodge. I m trying to figure out if i have understood the mechanics right, especially the ones concerning whole body control and how everything fits togheter. For what i have understood, only the CP of neck and torso deal a malus to the dodge (and, of course, to resist to knockdown, because all rolls are quick contest, based on ST or skills). So, referring to a case where you are grappling an opponent's leg, for 10 CP, the referred control points on torso and head/neck will be 5 and 5. But, if your opponent tries to dodge, he has a total of 10 referred CP and thus -5 to ST and DX= -5 to dodge. Is it right?? Assuming so, let try to make it harder. Now i'm going to grapple both arms of my opponent, the right one for 8 CP and second for 4 CP. First of all, i find the whole CP for every location 1) right arm= 8 CP 2) left arm= 4 CP 3)torso, legs, neck= 6 CP now, because the sum of grappled parts (arms) is 12 and both arms have more than 12/4=3 CP, they strenghten themselves for 3 more CP 1)right arm= 11 CP: -5 ST/DX 2)left arm= 7 CP: -3 ST/DX 3)torso, neck, legs=6 CP: -3 ST/DX Final dodge malus= -6 Is it everything right?? Last thing i m been asking, Trained stenght used for quick contests, is the one calculated via table at page 47 in technical grappling right? so, if have 10 of strenght, with Amr ST 2 and wrestling at DX+4, and i'm grappling with both hands and legs, i have= (10 ST+ 2 arm ST) * 1.5 both arms and legs multiplier + 3 for wrestling (fast training)= 21. If i'm trying to arm lock, my quick contest roll in this case is 21 ( my training ST). Did i do any error?? thank you for answers |
01-16-2018, 08:36 PM | #2 | |||
Doctor of GURPS Ballistics
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Lakeville, MN
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Re: technical grappling, whole body CP and dodge malus
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But the table calls out Arm ST as one of the situations where you need to calculate Trained ST using your basic lift. Two arms with ST 12, two legs with ST 10, x 1.2 for legs is also ST 12. So BL for ST 12 is 28.8 lbs, doubled for arms and legs is 57.6. The ST that gives you BL 57.6 is 16.97 . .. call it ST 17. Then add +3 for the Wrestling Training Bonus for a total ST 20. That's a control point roll of 2d-1.
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01-17-2018, 03:38 AM | #3 | ||||
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Italy, Rome
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Re: technical grappling, whole body CP and dodge malus
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Again, if i understand correctly, is the sum of the CP from head and torso that is used to count the malus Quote:
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without using lbs is just faster thank you for answers |
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01-17-2018, 09:01 AM | #4 | |
Doctor of GURPS Ballistics
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Lakeville, MN
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Re: technical grappling, whole body CP and dodge malus
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I think you have it right; the referred torso and head combine. I'm going to make an alternate house rule suggestion on my blog, because ugh.
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01-17-2018, 09:52 AM | #5 |
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Italy, Rome
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Re: technical grappling, whole body CP and dodge malus
i'm reading tons of different gurps balistic articles on TG
Amazing work, especially the TG "balck widow" fight scene in iron man 2 but i have still some problems.. the first is purely technical: techniques like joint lock, referre to quick contest of trained ST. I dont get it. It s the final strenght calculated AFTER have considered limbs used? for example: strenght 10, grabbing with both arms and legs is multiplied by 1,5, so strenght 15. Or is only the strenght + the bonus from advantages ( arm strenght, lif ecc..) and training in skill like wrestling, judo ecc?? in this case, only 10. Second: how do you handle all these numbers ( bonus and malus) during a game session? do you remember every single one?? I mean, gurps is briliant but sometime i feel overwhelmed edit: i'm trying to emulate a fight scene like this one: minute 3:50 more or less https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDW5epw8c3g it s Metal gear 3 in case you don t know it i just wish to understand better the rules to enjoy the fight more Last edited by Devil_Dante; 01-17-2018 at 10:12 AM. |
01-17-2018, 10:10 AM | #6 | ||
Doctor of GURPS Ballistics
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Lakeville, MN
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Re: technical grappling, whole body CP and dodge malus
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In your example of both arms and legs, the full Trained ST is 20. If you're applying 8 CP to some other dude's arm, and he's normally Trained ST 12, he's be at -4 to ST due to the grapple, for Trained ST 20 vs Trained ST 8. There's a reason this is a fight-ending position Quote:
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01-17-2018, 10:33 AM | #7 | ||
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Italy, Rome
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Re: technical grappling, whole body CP and dodge malus
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But, thanks, i had a a feeling to have misunderstood something. But wasn t sure about Okkam's answer :D Quote:
But my friends don t like too difficult stuff, so i'm trying to make things simplier, for them (cause i have explained them the rules) and for me ( cause i have to handle all stuff). For new players TG is a very difficult book, but i'm a completist and i like realistic rules. So, keep up the good work sir. Amazing. I can't stop thank you and whole team |
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01-17-2018, 10:37 AM | #8 |
Doctor of GURPS Ballistics
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Lakeville, MN
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Re: technical grappling, whole body CP and dodge malus
I assumed you were using your prior example - ST 10, Arm ST 2, Arms and Legs, Training bonus of +3 from wrestling.
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01-17-2018, 10:50 AM | #9 | |
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Italy, Rome
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Re: technical grappling, whole body CP and dodge malus
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by the way, are there other article about technical grappling, like the previous i have mentioned(https://gamingballistic.com/2013/10/...dow-in-iron/)? this one is very well done |
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01-17-2018, 11:00 AM | #10 |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: On the road again...
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Re: technical grappling, whole body CP and dodge malus
Minor nitpick: the word you're looking for is "penalty", not "malus". "Malus" is a word in English, but it's defined as "the return of performance-related compensation upon the discovery of deficient performance."
Not sure where the "malus is the opposite of bonus" bit came from, as I've never seen it anywhere other than on these forums.
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grappled defenses, referred control |
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