12-11-2014, 11:46 PM | #61 | |
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Charlotte, North Caroline, United States of America, Earth?
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Re: Unarmed vs. Knife
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Swings go for the legs, to take them out, thrusts go at the vitals or face, and I use armed grapple liberally with stamp kicks and knees to the groin.
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12-12-2014, 12:20 AM | #62 | ||
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Brighton
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Re: Unarmed vs. Knife
One other thing I'd left off the kicking/stamping to legs, is you get +1 to to hit of the legs of someone while standing, which softens the penalties a bit
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leaving aside the issue of arm locking the non attacking arm with a defensive arm lock, (which I agree seems a bit counter to the image I have in my head). You have to get into CC to actually arm lock. And in Basic are there facing rules in CC? The bit about side and back facing in Campaigns seems to define in terms of defending and attacking 'side' and 'back' as the hexes in that direction. Now Technical Grappling has lots on relative facing in CC and changing it, and the advantages and disadvantages of it, and I'd be happy to infer the basic rules regarding side and back facing into basic CC, and add in facing changes once there as part of freeing yourself, but have I missed something? (I've been using TG so long now I tend to have to un-learn it) Either way barring committed attacks, I think you might have trouble getting to side hex on you retreat slip to then move into CC from your turn. If for no other reason your target going to have their own changes to change facing. That said I think the idea do committed attack arm lock to get into side attack position is quite fitting! |
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12-12-2014, 12:47 AM | #63 | |
GURPS FAQ Keeper
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyïv, Ukraine
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Re: Unarmed vs. Knife
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Yeah, seems to only distinguish back and front. |
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12-12-2014, 01:39 AM | #64 |
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Southern oregon
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Re: Unarmed vs. Knife
Now I have read through the thread and I have seen lots of talk of various mechanics. What I haven't seen in any examples of actual knife disarms. My original Martial Art was Jujitsu and I have since studied Aikido and Judo. While not my school the following series of Videos I have found handy for showing my GMs what my character was doing. I do know that some people on this thread have touched on similar techniques but sometimes it's best to have visuals to go with mechanics.
Jujitsu knife Defense |
12-12-2014, 02:46 AM | #65 | |
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Brighton
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Re: Unarmed vs. Knife
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However you target just has to change his facing before his attack relative facing is changed and it's no longer a wild swing to his side hex. The rules of changing facing are going to important here vis a vis what you do to your target.. And even then only in terms of determining what hexes you can move off into when leaving CC and weather or not you'll have to evade to do so. |
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12-12-2014, 03:05 AM | #66 | |
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Brighton
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Re: Unarmed vs. Knife
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OK first one looks like: defensive parry to arm lock to force position change to grapple with a change of two handed to arm to on wrist and on hand on head to Grapple add leg (or knee to head) both hand to wrist to Disarm second one (bit dark and we wrong side) Defensive arm lock (now I can't decide if that's a two handed arm lock, or one handed with combo elbow strike to the inside elbow*) to forced posture change (maybe combo with adding a hand to the grapple is the fort move was a grapple and strike) to Two handed disarm (I guess, can't really see) Third one Same as the second, only it looks more like a arm-lock applied with pain to get the target to release the knife rather than a straight disarm. Same question over weather that's a two handed arm lock or a one handed arm lock with elbow strike to joint combo*. Sorry not really my area (there is second video in the link but I haven't looked at that) *thing is since they are doing a display, strikes aren't going to be full speed/strength so the dividing line between grapple and strike blurs a bit. And ultimately the difference between an arm lock that ends in injury to the arm, and a combo grapple and strike that ends in injury to the arm, is also blurry (in RL if not in GURPS). Should of course say if it is grapple strike combo it not a defensive parry but more a wait and/stop hit etc, etc. And weather or not it's one handed grapple and them one handed strike, or a combo is a matter of time (but they look fast enough to be combos me) Last edited by Tomsdad; 12-12-2014 at 03:23 AM. |
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12-12-2014, 03:06 AM | #67 | |
GURPS FAQ Keeper
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyïv, Ukraine
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Re: Unarmed vs. Knife
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You can't use a strike or grapple when you CA, because then the opponent will be able to Retreat, and turn, while you're still outside Close Combat. But if you just use CA to step into his rear-left hex after he spent his step but before he Attacked you, he's stuck facing you with his left-rear side until your turn, after which you've got some opportunities. So you Feint instead (or simply forego the opportunity to feint if some houserule changes the way Feints work). Oh, and once your turn comes around, you can grapple his arm from the back side by stepping into his rear into Close Combat (his hex). Or Choke Hold. Or whatever. He still treats it as a runaround, but there are other benefits; and if he's got a greathelm with No Peripheral Vision, he can't benefit from runaround rules. |
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12-12-2014, 03:18 AM | #68 | |||
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Brighton
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Re: Unarmed vs. Knife
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We seem to have gown a bit beyond the original situation* here, nothing wrong with that of course just trying to clarify what we're now trying to do! *Parry to Defensive arm lock with slip to get on the side hex before applying the arm lock with the bonuses of being a side attack and away from the knife side. Last edited by Tomsdad; 12-12-2014 at 03:39 AM. |
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12-12-2014, 03:35 AM | #69 | ||
GURPS FAQ Keeper
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyïv, Ukraine
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Re: Unarmed vs. Knife
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A Feint is a QC, not an attack->active_defence event. So no Retreat, and no risk of being Parried with a knife with a subsequent success at the cut-the-arm roll. I thought Arm Lock wasn't supposed to be the only solution. Anyway, 4 levels of Arm Lock is good here, and can be used for Deceptive Attack. |
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12-12-2014, 04:03 AM | #70 | ||||
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Brighton
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Re: Unarmed vs. Knife
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You can step with a feint of course, but then your target has an extra chance to change his facing as well. Quote:
Four levels of arm lock is indeed always good! |
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martial arts, technical grapping, technical grappling |
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