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Old 11-08-2013, 12:28 AM   #1
jtsmith1287
 
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Default 4 swings?

I'm struggling to understand the Extra attack and the double all out attack. The extra attack states you get two attack maneuvers so long as you have a weapon that didn't need to be readied to be used, so basically not a crossbow or unbalanced weapon or something similar. However, this starts to feel really broken when coupled with the double attack as it grants 4 swings, or am I reading this wrong?
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Old 11-08-2013, 12:30 AM   #2
Nereidalbel
 
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Default Re: 4 swings?

If you have Extra Attacks, only one of them can be an AoA. I believe the same goes for Dual Weapon Attacks, but I could be wrong on that one.
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Old 11-08-2013, 01:02 AM   #3
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Default Re: 4 swings?

You can only make one "double" attack per round.
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Old 11-08-2013, 01:30 AM   #4
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Default Re: 4 swings?

Extra Attack does not give you maneuvers, it gives you attacks. Extra Attack gives you one additional attack when you take an Attack/AoA/etc. If you take an AoA double, that means you have three attacks.
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Old 11-09-2013, 06:20 PM   #5
Peter Knutsen
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Default Re: 4 swings?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nereidalbel View Post
If you have Extra Attacks, only one of them can be an AoA. I believe the same goes for Dual Weapon Attacks, but I could be wrong on that one.
I'm waiting for a Cosmic Enhancement to change that rule.
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Old 11-09-2013, 10:24 PM   #6
Ulzgoroth
 
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Default Re: 4 swings?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Knutsen View Post
I'm waiting for a Cosmic Enhancement to change that rule.
Uh. AoA is a Maneuver, not an attack option, so that half of it doesn't make any sense.
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Old 11-08-2013, 02:12 AM   #7
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Default Re: 4 swings?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtsmith1287 View Post
I'm struggling to understand the Extra attack and the double all out attack. The extra attack states you get two attack maneuvers so long as you have a weapon that didn't need to be readied to be used, so basically not a crossbow or unbalanced weapon or something similar. However, this starts to feel really broken when coupled with the double attack as it grants 4 swings, or am I reading this wrong?
Yes, "All Out Attack - Double" is misleadingly named. You never get more than one extra attack. You can get another by using Dual Weapon Attack or Rapid Strike (but not both, you can only use on DWA or Rapid strike per Maneuver).
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Old 11-08-2013, 05:26 AM   #8
SCAR
 
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Default Re: 4 swings?

And just to make this clear with a page reference: the entry for Extra Attack - Basic: Characters, p.53-54 states:

for Extra Attack and All-Out Attack:

If he chooses All-Out Attack (Double) to increase his number of attacks, he gets one additional attack.

for Extra Attack and Rapid Strike:

You may use one of your melee attacks to make a Rapid Strike (see p. 370) on your turn, at the usual penalty. Your remaining attacks are in addition to this Rapid Strike, and receive no penalty. You may not use Rapid Strike with two or more attacks in one turn.

Also, Martial Arts, p126-127 - Multiple Attacks covers the various options pretty thoroughly.

Last edited by SCAR; 11-08-2013 at 05:30 AM.
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Old 11-08-2013, 05:36 AM   #9
davidtmoore
 
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Default Re: 4 swings?

Where it gets silly is when you stack Altered Time Rate with Extra Attack, All-Out Attack, and Rapid Strike.

For a couple hundred points, you can get Trained by a Master, Altered Time Rate 1, and Extra Attacks 2, then take All-Out Attack (Double) twice, making 3-attack Rapid Strikes and adding two extra attacks to each maneuver, for a total of 12 attacks, half at full skill and half at -6.
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Old 11-08-2013, 06:02 AM   #10
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Default Re: 4 swings?

I actually dig that. For me, Altered Time Rate is an incredibly rare advantage - in fact, outside of Supers, I'm not sure when I'd ever let a PC take it. I'm fine with someone who spends that many points on a single ability attacking a bajillion times (without a defense), though.
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