Why use a SMG instead of a machine pistol?

[Curmudgeon]

While it is usually given in most literature as the distance between the front and rear sights which is more readily measured than the distance between the eye and the the front sight which will vary both with the exact point the firer rests his cheek and therefore his eye in relation to the front sight and doesn't require factoring in the differences in butt length for those weapons which have different butt lengths to better fit taller/shorter shooters, as long as your line of sight passes through the rear sight on its way to the front sight and target, the additional length provided by the stock does improve accuracy by adding to the length of the aiming arc.

Stability will help and a shoulder-held stock for a pistol should add greater stability than even a two-handed tactical firing stance (where the second hand braces the wrist of the firing hand.) The trade-off would be the reduced length of the arc of aim, which might lose most of the effect. Some officers I knew and talked to had fired shoulder-stock mounted pistols and regarded it as a worthless gimmick that increased the complexity of the weapon (marginally) for a negligible gain in effectiveness.

[Sam Cade]

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

the additional length provided by the stock does improve accuracy by adding to the length of the aiming arc.

Whut? Sight radius is the length between front and rear sights. A longer sight radius allows for more precise sight alignment. Period.

When you slap a stock onto a service pistol the sight radius doesn't change and the front sight is just wallowing around with an enormous amount of daylight on either side, since the eye is closer to the rear sight the notch isout of wack size wise. Suboptimal sight picture, but that is offset by the advantages that 3 points of contact offer.


Something like the KPOS, OTOH is a whole different kettle of fish.
http://www.fab-defense.com/en/catego...onversion.html

[Rupert]

Originally Posted by apoc527

I have plenty of experience firing guns, but NONE firing anything with a selector switch or full automatic capability. It seems to me that it's not super easy to fire short bursts without training. I'm pondering a house rule for ALL weapons set to full auto (i.e. no burst limiter is used) that goes like this:

Your ability to make short controlled bursts depends on your relative skill level:

Skill Level....Min RoF
DX+0....3/4 RoF
DX+1....1/2 RoF
DX+2....1/4 RoF

Maybe it's not THAT hard, and it should be more like 2/3, 1/2, 1/4, but eh, I just think the "choose any RoF between 1 and max" is a little generous for guns even without the ! symbol.

Firing a short burst is easy. Firing one of exactly the right number of rounds is the hard part. Were I feeling pedantic I'd require players who wish their character to fire less than the full RoF to roll 1d3-2 (this can go negative - that's the point) and add that to the desired number to get the actual number of shots fired. At RoF 15+, make that 2d3-4, and at RoF 25+ use 2d6-7 or more.

[Rupert]

Originally Posted by RyanW

Realistically, RoF 15 should be treated as switchable between of RoF 3 or RoF 15!

It is - it takes a ready action to swap between them unless the weapon has a progessive trigger or equivalent.

[Polydamas]

Something like the KPOS, OTOH is a whole different kettle of fish.
http://www.fab-defense.com/en/catego...onversion.html

Wow, cool gadget. What is the purpose, compared to just buying a pistol and a light, short folding-stock carbine with a vertical foregrip? It sounds like the shooters here aren't enthusiastic about stocked pistols.

Originally Posted by Rupert

It is - it takes a ready action to swap between them unless the weapon has a progessive trigger or equivalent.

High Tech specifies whether a weapon requires a Ready manoeuvre to swap between fully-automatic and semi-automatic.

Its not explicit that weapons with RoF x have a minimum burst size, only that ones with RoF x! do. This is because the rule for minimum burst size is in the Basic Set (p. B408), where they wisely decided that they didn't want to have to explain about the difference between semi-auto, limited bursts, and fully automatic modes. But I would apply it to all fully automatic fire anyways in a game using the full firearms rules from High Tech or Tactical Shooting.

[Sam Cade]

Originally Posted by Polydamas

Wow, cool gadget. What is the purpose, compared to just buying a pistol and a light, short folding-stock carbine with a vertical foregrip?

Well, I've got a SBR'ed MKE-94K, a semi-auto turkish MP5K clone.

I'm selling it to fund a G17+KPOS since the KPOS is a better optics platform, is just as accurate, reliable as a crowbar and is considerably more compact.


From a departmental perspective, a chassis like the KPOS would be much cheaper than buying (and supporting) 2 firearms

I've not shot a RONI equipped pistol, but they feel terrible.
http://www.caatactical.com/viewCategory.asp?catID=376

Any of the "plug" type stocks for a Glock will make it a much more effective weapon.