+1/-1 to Run Away

[50mm]

Ok my wife and I just bought the game and were playing it tonight... (haven't played in 5 years, glad to be back)... and a question we can't seem to resolve came up.

The Elf Race card says "+1 to Run Away", and the Halfling Race card says "-1 to Run Away".

What exactly does this mean?

I interpreted it to mean that the Elf can roll a 4, 5, or 6 to successfully run away, whereas the Halfling must roll only a 6 to run away. But my wife doesn't think that makes sense.

So what is the true calculation on this? are we way off base?

Thanks, can't wait to get an answer. Love Munckin, Thanks Steve!

[Jarlaxle]

You're correct. Normally you need a 5 or 6 to run away. An easy way to think of this is ignore the + and - 1 and roll the die. After the die is rolled look at the modifier. If you rolled a 4 and are an Elf take 4+1 you get 5, success. Now if you roll a 5 as a Halfling take 5-1 you get 4, failure and bad stuff. Hope that helps. In more simple terms the + or - is what you add or subtract from your run away roll. It took me a bit to rationalize that as well. Also note that modifiers are stackable. If you're a half-breed Elf/Halfling then the +1 and -1 cancel out. If you are a 1/3 Breed Elf/Gnome/Halfling you're at -1. Items (such as Boots of Running Really Fast), and monsters (such as Snails on Speed) also modify run away rolls.

[MunchkinMan]

Originally Posted by Jarlaxle

An easy way to think of this is ignore the + and - 1 and roll the die. After the die is rolled look at the modifier.

Why is this the "easy" way? It actually requires the players to perform math, so, technically, that's the hard way. It's actually easier on the players to spell out the acceptable values. However, more words on a limited space was not wanted. The application of these modifiers was intended that the player would apply the "modifier" to his roll.

Originally Posted by The Rules

Roll the die. You only escape on a 5 or better. Elves get a bonus to run away, while halflings have a penalty. Some magic items make it easier or harder to run away. And some monsters are fast, and give you a penalty to your roll.

And, to the OP, ask your wife this: How does it not make sense that an Elf, often portrayed as fleet of foot, would be able to Run Away more easily, and a Halfling, unquestionably short on leg, would have a harder time of it?

[MunchkinMan]

Originally Posted by Jarlaxle

Also note that modifiers are stackable. If you're a half-breed Elf/Halfling then the +1 and -1 cancel out. If you are a 1/3 Breed Elf/Gnome/Halfling you're at -1. Items (such as Boots of Running Really Fast), and monsters (such as Snails on Speed) also modify run away rolls.

Somewhere, I have refuted this notion, but searching all morning has only wasted my morning. . . A Halfling-Gnome is -1 to Run Away because that's the same disadvantage, just as a Elf-Feline is +1 (same advantage). If someone has better search fu than me and can find it, that would be great.

[Jarlaxle]

Originally Posted by MunchkinMan

Somewhere, I have refuted this notion, but searching all morning has only wasted my morning. . . A Halfling-Gnome is -1 to Run Away because that's the same disadvantage, just as a Elf-Feline is +1 (same advantage). If someone has better search fu than me and can find it, that would be great.

Okay that makes sense. But I was right on other counts right? Like Elf and halfling cancelling eachother out. And does that mean elf halfling and gnome still cancel eachother out as well?

[Jarlaxle]

Originally Posted by MunchkinMan

Why is this the "easy" way? It actually requires the players to perform math, so, technically, that's the hard way. It's actually easier on the players to spell out the acceptable values. However, more words on a limited space was not wanted. The application of these modifiers was intended that the player would apply the "modifier" to his roll.

Well it made it personally easier for me when I learned. When I first saw +1 to run away my head thought you need a +1 higher number so only a six. (might sound dumb but it's true). So once I learned the actual intent by rolling and then adding the modifier afterwards gave me a rationalization for the numbers. Now I don't need to do that but it truly was easier for me when I was learnimg.

[MunchkinMan]

Originally Posted by Jarlaxle

Okay that makes sense. But I was right on other counts right? Like Elf and halfling cancelling eachother out. And does that mean elf halfling and gnome still cancel eachother out as well?

Yes, the advantages and disadvantages would cancel out.

Bear in mind that a second bonus or penalty, like that from an Item, would still stack with the Race advantages/disadvantages.

[mawile]

hm... i would say, an elf-halfling would run faster, then elf-halfling-gnome, just because there is less elves and more shortlegged genes:)
and i would understand, why a feline-elf would run even faster, then usual felines or elves... they may have different running trainings and halfbred may practice both...
and a gnome-halfling may become twice slow, because it is now half a gnome, not half a human =D

anyway it is not obvious, that you should not use same advantages and disadvantages.. i can use both warior's and cleric's "discard for a bonus" ability... why can't i stack +1 to run away of both races?... it doesn't make a feline-elf overpowerful and it does not let you have advantages of a gnome for free, if you are already a halfling.... and it is the easy way to stack bonuses... we want Munckin to be simple easy...

yes, i see it, as an official rulling, but maybe it is not too late to change the ruling?...

[Death]

I agree with mawile that it is an unusual complicated ruling especially if you take into account that you can stack your race run away bonus with item run away bonuses.

[MunchkinMan]

From a real-world perspective, why would a taking someone roughly 3' tall, and mating it with someone else roughly 3' tall create a 1.5' tall child (when fully grown)? That's kinda what you're suggesting. Heck, if it did work that way, the smaller adult child could probably have an advantage over the larger adults because more hiding places are available, assuming they can reach one fast enough with their teeny, tiny little legs.

No, it's not that complicated a ruling, it's very simple: It's the same advantage or disadvantage and it doesn't get duplicated. And, stacking because of a bonus or penalty from a separate source doesn't complicate that ruling, nor does it invalidate it because that bonus or penalty comes from a different circumstance than the Race-based bonus/penalty.