Possibility to "Cancel" Divine Intervention

DojimaDragon · 03-14-2010, 03:51 PM

We just had a game which was (quite munchkinly) resulting in a loud argument which was solved by the last word of the game owner. But I'm looking for a general solution.
The problem was caused by the card "Divine Intervention". The card was drawn face up and would have ended the game by raising a cleric to the 10th level. Another player however chose to play the card "Steal a Level" within 2,6 seconds after "Divine Intervention" was drawn to steal a level from the cleric the moment, Divine Intervention takes place. I, being the cleric, argued, that the 2,6 seconds rule only applies to combats. The game owner based his argument on his right to play the "Steal a Level" card ANY time.

I'd like to have either your opinions or preferably a definitive solution to this problem. Thanks for your input!

Kirt · 03-14-2010, 04:30 PM

Yes, the owner of the Steal a Level has the right to play it at any time. He could have played it before DI was drawn. However, once DI is drawn he cannot go back in time and play it before Divine Intervention. Thus, he is playing it after DI. And once DI has resolved, the game ended, so after DI is effectively after the end of the game.

Munchkin has no stack. Once Divine Intervention is revealed, the only thing that can stop its resolution is something specifically targeting it or its resolution (Annihilate, Make the GM...Nose, etc.).

RL · 03-14-2010, 08:00 PM

As Erik and Andrew have stressed in the past, the 2.6-second rule is only for the end of combat.

In your particular case, the game is over as soon as Divine Intervention is played, unless someone uses Annihilate (or a similar card) which specifically says it [retroactively] cancels a card that was just played.

PK · 03-15-2010, 12:31 PM

The 2.6 second rule has nothing to do with it. That rule is basically to stop people from "speed-playing", such as "I go looking for trouble, fight this monster, play Friendly on it, take its treasure, and draw four Treasures <draw draw draw draw>, your turn!" It has nothing to do with actual timing.

Munchkin is a FIFO game -- if I trigger one effect and then you trigger another effect, mine happens, and then yours happens. So if I play a card that takes me to level 10, and then you play a card that reduces my level, it means I go to level 10, then you take me back to level 9 . . . but I still won, because I hit 10. Game over.

The exception is canceling. Any card that says it "cancels" another card is treated as an "interrupt", or a LIFO effect. So if I play a card that takes me to level 10, and you play a card to cancel that card, then I never went to level 10 in the first place so I don't win.

Make sense?

DojimaDragon · 03-17-2010, 08:12 PM

Thanks for your answers. Especially for seeing things my way :D I think this issue is solved :)

03-14-2010, 03:51 PM	#1
DojimaDragon Join Date: Mar 2010	Possibility to "Cancel" Divine Intervention We just had a game which was (quite munchkinly) resulting in a loud argument which was solved by the last word of the game owner. But I'm looking for a general solution. The problem was caused by the card "Divine Intervention". The card was drawn face up and would have ended the game by raising a cleric to the 10th level. Another player however chose to play the card "Steal a Level" within 2,6 seconds after "Divine Intervention" was drawn to steal a level from the cleric the moment, Divine Intervention takes place. I, being the cleric, argued, that the 2,6 seconds rule only applies to combats. The game owner based his argument on his right to play the "Steal a Level" card ANY time. I'd like to have either your opinions or preferably a definitive solution to this problem. Thanks for your input!

03-14-2010, 04:30 PM	#2
Kirt Join Date: Aug 2009	Re: Possibility to "Cancel" Divine Intervention Yes, the owner of the Steal a Level has the right to play it at any time. He could have played it before DI was drawn. However, once DI is drawn he cannot go back in time and play it before Divine Intervention. Thus, he is playing it after DI. And once DI has resolved, the game ended, so after DI is effectively after the end of the game. Munchkin has no stack. Once Divine Intervention is revealed, the only thing that can stop its resolution is something specifically targeting it or its resolution (Annihilate, Make the GM...Nose, etc.). Last edited by Kirt; 03-14-2010 at 10:47 PM.

03-14-2010, 08:00 PM	#3
RL Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Colorado	Re: Possibility to "Cancel" Divine Intervention As Erik and Andrew have stressed in the past, the 2.6-second rule is only for the end of combat. In your particular case, the game is over as soon as Divine Intervention is played, unless someone uses Annihilate (or a similar card) which specifically says it [retroactively] cancels a card that was just played. __________________ Check out my Munchkin trade post Last edited by RL; 03-14-2010 at 08:11 PM.

03-15-2010, 12:31 PM	#4
PK Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Dobbstown Sane Asylum	Re: Possibility to "Cancel" Divine Intervention The 2.6 second rule has nothing to do with it. That rule is basically to stop people from "speed-playing", such as "I go looking for trouble, fight this monster, play Friendly on it, take its treasure, and draw four Treasures <draw draw draw draw>, your turn!" It has nothing to do with actual timing. Munchkin is a FIFO game -- if I trigger one effect and then you trigger another effect, mine happens, and then yours happens. So if I play a card that takes me to level 10, and then you play a card that reduces my level, it means I go to level 10, then you take me back to level 9 . . . but I still won, because I hit 10. Game over. The exception is canceling. Any card that says it "cancels" another card is treated as an "interrupt", or a LIFO effect. So if I play a card that takes me to level 10, and you play a card to cancel that card, then I never went to level 10 in the first place so I don't win. Make sense? __________________ Reverend Pee Kitty of the Order Malkavian-Dobbsian (Twitter) (LJ) MyGURPS: My house rules and *GURPS* resources. #SJGamesLive: I answered questions about *GURPS After the End* and more! {Watch Video} - {Read Transcript}

03-17-2010, 08:12 PM	#5
DojimaDragon Join Date: Mar 2010	Re: Possibility to "Cancel" Divine Intervention Thanks for your answers. Especially for seeing things my way :D I think this issue is solved :)