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Old 11-25-2020, 03:50 PM   #21
OldSam
 
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Default Re: Fantasy Grounds Unity GURPS?

...well, you have a point, I also really wonder why SJG is not making some deal with the Fantasy Grounds guys, not being represented there officially is a disadvantage as it is probably the leading commercial online RPG platform.
Many others are on the list: https://fantasygroundsunity.atlassia...lable+Rulesets

Fun fact, my own group is currently thinking about buying FGU, but we're still hesitating because of the lack of official GURPS support...

@SJG: Is something planned in that direction?


On the other hand, at least the community support for GURPS rules with FGU seems to be ok, so at least you should be able to use basic features.

Last edited by OldSam; 11-25-2020 at 03:54 PM.
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Old 11-30-2020, 02:25 PM   #22
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Default Re: Fantasy Grounds Unity GURPS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldSam View Post
On the other hand, at least the community support for GURPS rules with FGU seems to be ok, so at least you should be able to use basic features.
The thing is that (for me) GURPS is about the books. I don't know much about how the FG GURPS group operates, but it sounds like they don't have the books. And if the GURPS books are somehow available, wouldn't those basically be pirated? Is SJG allowing them or granting certain permissions?

Generally speaking, I don't have the time or inclination to jerk around with that. I would MUCH rather have a licensed product. Unless there's some crazy circumstance I don't know about, it really looks like SJG is leaving money on the table. And Savage Worlds is picking up said money.
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Old 11-30-2020, 03:47 PM   #23
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Default Re: Fantasy Grounds Unity GURPS?

Are you sure that Savage Worlds, D&D etc. really offer the full book content along with FGU? I would have assumed just options to use the rules...
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Old 11-30-2020, 04:02 PM   #24
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Default Re: Fantasy Grounds Unity GURPS?

I would like to see SJG on these VTT platforms in a highly visible way. However the frequent calls for it often seem to be to assume its a no brainer and SJG is "leaving money on the table" and I think people aren't factoring everything in.
  • SJG had a bad history with licensing their material to another computer based company and that kind of thing can make you very cautious.
  • What protections do they have against piracy?
  • How much money does the VTT company get out of the deal that may come from SJG pockets vs. how much could they make in new sales for themselves?
  • How much time/money will it cost to work out such a deal? Staff need to spend time working out details and lawyers need to be payed too.

Those are not trivial issues and a company like Hasbro is way bigger and has deeper pockets than SJG. If one of these VTT companies messed with Hasbro they could take them to court and likely win or force the VTT company to settle.
I hope this kind of thing happens too, I just think people believe it is easy and free to do.
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Old 11-30-2020, 04:26 PM   #25
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Default Re: Fantasy Grounds Unity GURPS?

People asking for "official support" need to consider what, specifically, they mean by that.

GCA is officially supported by all accounts, but SJG has nothing at all to do with its development, and has devoted no resources to its support, as far as I'm aware. Fantasy Grounds would be no exception in that regard.

My group has been using FG for over a decade now, and the lack of "built in" GURPS content has been no impediment whatsoever, and its addition would likely have little effect on our gaming experience. That said, actual GURPS content for FG is going to depend on the community to provide it (with SJG's eventual blessing to distribute, however/whenever that happens).
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Old 11-30-2020, 05:59 PM   #26
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Default Re: Fantasy Grounds Unity GURPS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldSam View Post
Are you sure that Savage Worlds, D&D etc. really offer the full book content along with FGU? I would have assumed just options to use the rules...
If you buy the book dlc for those products on FG, it includes the full text and images from the book (with one exception so far being the kickstarter NPCs for the Modiphious 2d20 Conan rpg).

However, there are a number of rulesets included with the software that only include the ruleset (mechannical aspects) but not the text of the books (if there's an SRD that is usually included).
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Old 12-01-2020, 09:39 AM   #27
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Default Re: Fantasy Grounds Unity GURPS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Refplace View Post
I think people aren't factoring everything in.
  • SJG had a bad history with licensing their material to another computer based company and that kind of thing can make you very cautious.
  • What protections do they have against piracy?
  • How much money does the VTT company get out of the deal that may come from SJG pockets vs. how much could they make in new sales for themselves?
  • How much time/money will it cost to work out such a deal? Staff need to spend time working out details and lawyers need to be payed too.
This is why you hire a business attorney. This is *exactly* what they do. None of these issues are anything new under the sun.

As a consumer, it's not my job to work out the details of a prospective business deal. However, as a consumer, it is entirely normal and often appreciated to say "hey company, here's how you can have a lot more of my money."

SJG doesn't owe me an explanation as to why they haven't entered into a business deal, but since they set up these forums, why not ask?

And while SJG doesn't owe me an explanation, they should consider the ramifications of not communicating with their clients about a frequently raised issue. By the way, if they have, I just don't know about it. PLEASE feel free to tell me "hey dumbass, they did that here [insert link]."

My problem is that I'm becoming invested in one game that's okay but I would rather be investing in GURPS. If I knew that SJG has plans to go to Fantasy Grounds, I would hold off on investing in another game.

As an aside, it seems to me that SJG already has a hell of piracy problem. With minimal digging, you can find pirated PDFs of just about any GURPS books. If anything, contracting with a digital platform could very much help with making sure SJG is compensated for its content.
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Old 12-01-2020, 10:09 AM   #28
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Default Re: Fantasy Grounds Unity GURPS?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gigermann View Post
GCA is officially supported by all accounts...
GCA? That thing is still around? I remember using it ages ago. GCA looked 15 years old the day it was published. LOL It was little more than an Excel form and not nearly as pretty.

What I want by official support from SJG for Fantasy Grounds is exactly what I'm getting from several other games already on the platform: rules, character creation, skills, advantages, NPCs, images, maps, modules, the works. There is no mystery here since numerous other games have blazed the trail already.

I'm happy that there is a Fantasy Grounds GURPS community. Akin to a video game modding community, I'm sure you guys are doing amazing things. But I'm the customer that wants it all baked into the product. I don't want to mod FG for GURPS or go outside FG to be able to play GURPS. I don't have to do that with other games, and those other games are getting my money as a result.

Here's another thing. I used to buy GURPS books ALL THE TIME. I have a couple of bookshelves of GURPS books. I would buy MANY of those same damn books all over again if they were in Fantasy Grounds. SJG has such an amazing reservoir of material, and it's a shame that I can't get it in a modern VTT platform.
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Old 12-02-2020, 12:26 PM   #29
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Default Re: Fantasy Grounds Unity GURPS?

I don't know why or what the limitations they have but there are other VTT and many companies seem to sell their stuff on multiple platforms. I personally use role20 and probably wouldn't be able to get my game group to convert so a general VTT that could be made available on multiple VTT. It seems like the path would be a license agreement like they have with Dungeon.Fantastic but with someone who wanted who wanted to do vtt. Probably limited to tools that does the math with uploaded character sheets.

I can hope
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Old 12-06-2020, 02:31 AM   #30
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Default Re: Fantasy Grounds Unity GURPS?

I've only worked with FGU. I purchased the Ultimate license and my players run it with the Demo.

So far, so good: the interface works fairly seamlessly in my opinion, once you understand how to work with images and maps, enter story lines, and build your own encounters. I use more of a narrative style in writing adventures, and so I love being able to generate material for the players to read on the VTT.

The work that the FG GURPS community has generated has been the selling feature for me. They've done an amazing job to get you feeling like the VTT is tailored for GURPS.

We used GCA to initially build characters and exported them. And now the players are spending their character points, and simply do the math, and change the data in-game on the character sheets (which, admittedly, they see as requiring an entry level course in spreadsheets ;)) I also use GCA to build NPCs and export those as well.

I've purchased map packs and now can easily create battle maps with hex grids, build LOS and I'm enjoying the ways that you can adjust lighting in the map, add special effects, doors and windows that open and close, etc.

The players all agree that it would be amazing to have license support, but I know that not having access to online SJG material has generated at least some PDF sales for SJG as the players are now interested to own copies of the rules themselves.

And, SJG does offer GURPS Lite as a free download for anyone who wants to play the game in its simplest form.

So all in all, a good experience. Wrinkles will continue to be ironed out not just by the FG GURPS developers, but FG developers as well. They do seem to take an interest in our posts about things that work and don't work so well.
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