DF: Forgotten Realms Martial-Arts Styles

[Gef]

Originally Posted by CousinX

Advanced Remise

Why use a separate version of the technique when you can already combine techniques?

Attack with option to remise, skill -2 plus whatever you spent for the technique. It fails, so the option kicks in, attack again at skill -2, plus Remise technique, with further -5, plus Counterattack technique. Of course, if I've spent points to max each technique, then I take no net penalty myself, but the net penalty for my foe is -4 to parry: -2 for second parry in a turn, -2 more for Counterattack.

GEF

[Gef]

CousinX, this discussion has been useful to me, as your criticism of the complexity of my Skill Limitation quirks has inspired me to streamline them. First, I realized that I could roll Technique Focus into the other variants; it still winds up as a net limitation. To balance this, I have removed the note about figured statistics (i.e., parry) for most versions. What do you think of it now?

Technique Focus (Skill Limitation Quirks)
3 points each

You have studied a combat skill extensively but in the limited context of a martial arts style, gaining a discounted but limited level of skill. Each Technique Focus is technically a quirk paired with a skill level; that is, for a net cost of 3 points, you acquire a +1 bonus with certain uses of a skill, and you may have only one Technique Focus level for each skill, though you could change it when you raise your skill, representing your evolving philosophy of combat, especially if you train with a new master. Technique Focus is cost-effective for advanced students who have spent at least 4 points on a skill. The bonus applies to all techniques for that skill taught by your style in addition to certain other attacks, so Style Adaptation is quite useful in conjunction. (This rule works best when styles have about half a dozen non-cinematic techniques per skill.) Never double-count the bonus from Technique Focus. For example, if a Defensive stylist uses one of his techniques in a Defensive Attack, he still gets only a +1 bonus, not +2.

Technique Foci appear in a style's recommended traits, but replacing the recommended variant with a different one is a simple way to define substyles. For example, the style above might have a substyle that particularly favors the longsword over the bastard sword, swapping Defensive for Favored Weapon. Its proponents would aggressively argue for the superiority of their weapon, and would fight more aggressively, too.

Aggressive: You get +1 with any All-Out Attack (Strong), Committed Attack (Strong), or Extra Effort (Mighty Blow), and also with any beat even if Feint is not a technique of your style.

Deceptive: You reduce the penalty for a Deceptive Attack by 1, and you get +1 for tricks even if Feint is not a technique of your style. Count your Technique Focus as a level of skill for the purpose of calculating Block or Parry. Deceptive styles likely include Feint, Return Strike, Riposte, or Spinning technique.

Defensive: You get +1 with any Defensive Attack, attack from Wait including a Stop Hit, or to any attack which accrues a bonus from a prior Evaluate maneuver, and also to any defensive Feint even if Feint is noty a technique of your style. Count your Technique Focus as a level of skill for the purpose of calculating Block or Parry. Defensive styles are likely include Counterattack.

Fast: You get +1 to sequence with the affected skill and +1 with Rapid Strikes, including All-Out Attack (Double), All-Out Attack (Feint), Dual-Weapon Attack, and any Combination.

Favored Mode: Your bonus depends on the skill: you get +1 when you Aim with a ranged attack skill, or +1 when you use Spear skill with a one-handed spear, or +1 when you thrust with a skill that can also be used with swings, or +1 when you attack with your legs using an unarmed skill, as in the case of a Jump Kick or Triangle Choke.

Favored Weapon: You get +1 to all uses of a specific weapon, in addition to the bonus for your style's techniques with any weapon to which your skill applies. For example, you might specify the glaive as your favored weapon under Staff skill, in conjunction with the perk Weapon Adaptation. For ultra-tech weapons, specify the technology, such as lasers for a Beam Weapons skill; specialization with a mass-produced model such as a Colt 1911A pistol is a Weapon Bond perk instead (assuming manufacturing to close tolerances).

Mobile: You get +1 with All-Out Attack (Long), any Move and Attack, to any Committed Attack when you exercise the option to take an extra step, and to certain forms of Extra Effort (Great Lunge and Heroic Charge). For non-kinemagic warriors, the bonus for Move and Attack raises the Wild Swing skill cap from 9 to 10.

Aggressive (Heroic Charge): Your limited skill level applies only with Extra Effort (Heroic Charge) or with a Move and Attack (subject to the restrictions on a Wild Swing as usual).

Precise: You get +1 for called shots to penalized locations, including pressure points and chinks in armor.

GEF

PS: "The style above" referred to in the opening paragraph is much like your Hand-and-Half style in concept:


Imperial Swordmanship (3)
The sword is the most romanticized weapon in the Empire of the Shards; while the lance is the weapon of a company of knights at war, the sword is the weapon of the storied knight-errant. In fact, not all knights are cavalry, and this was even more true in early Taleria. Academies of swordsmanship keep this Talric martial art alive, and as knights turn to chivalry, sword masters take more civilian students from the merchant class. While a modest shield is in vogue among swordsmen who are also lancers, many modern sword masters dispense with it altogether in favor of a reinforced (two-handed) grip for defense, while those who remember the tradition of knights on foot prefer a large shield like a kite. For backup, they teach knife and unarmed skills, and indeed they may initiate a bind and follow it with a knee strike or fast-draw. The style is more cautious than aggressive, eschewing the vulnerability of a Committed or All-Out Attack, advocating the strong defense followed by a Counterattack. Feint, Wait, and Evaluate are important tactics, and some masters teach the trick of holding a sword “backwards” to use the quillions for a hook, or for the “murder stroke” technique (Hard, defaults at ‑3, cannot be exceed sword skill) based on a Committed or All-Out Attack for extra swing damage at a further +2, but changed to crushing. Given the style's cautious approach, this is reserved as a finishing move for reeling foes. Proponents of popular substyles argue the merits of thrust vs. swing, favoring longsword and bastard sword respectively.

Recommended Traits: Cultural Familiarity (Imperial), Defensive, Language (Talrese), Shtick: Twirl (for hooking with quillions)

Skills: Broadsword

Optional Skills: Blindfighting*, Brawling, Fast-Draw (Knife, Sword), Ghostly Weapon¹, Knife, Mental Strength*, Parry Missile (Broadsword), Penetrating Strike: Shift², Power Blow*, Shield, Soldier, Strike of Negation³, Supernatural Awareness*, Thrown Weapon (Knife), Wrestling

Techniques: Brawling*– Groundfighting, Knee Strike; Broadsword*– Bind, Counterattack, Dual-Weapon Defense*, Feint, Hook, Murder Stroke, Retain Weapon, Timed Defense*, Whirlwind Attack*; Knife*– Feint, Target Torso Chink; Wrestling*– Arm Lock, Disarm

Signature Perk: Shield Wall or Weapon Adaptation (Broadsword => choose either Longsword or Thrusting Bastard Sword in two-handed grip)

Perks: Grip Mastery (Longsword, Thrusting Bastard Sword), Skill Adaptation (Broadsword => Bind, Hook reversed), Unique Technique (Murder Stroke)

Familiarity: Broadsword, cane, dagger, large knife, long knife, longsword, medium shield, rondel dagger, small knife, small shield, stilletto, thrusting bastard sword, thrusting broadsword


PPS: As you can see, I apply the "Unique Technique" perk even for techniques that do not violate the usual rules for creating new techniques, if instruction is limited to a particular style in the campaign world.

[Gef]

CousinX,

Obviously we're designing styles for different fantasy worlds, but if my examples suggest we're on parallel tracks, PM me with a place to send the whole durn file. I think I'm a bit farther along this road. I'd ask two things: 1) realize it's a work in progress; the parts that aren't finished are fairly obvious. 2) For the ones you study enough to adapt, I'd appreciate feedback on what makes sense, especially if you have real experience in addition to the Martial Arts book to go on. -GEF

[CousinX]

Originally Posted by Gef

Why use a separate version of the technique when you can already combine techniques?

Well, I think this is distinct enough from a normal Counterattack to warrant a separate technique ... Counterattack specifically only works after you successfully defend against an attack, and doesn't come into effect until your next turn. The Counterattack mechanics seem appropriate, but using Counterattack itself seems like double-dipping.

Originally Posted by Gef

CousinX, this discussion has been useful to me, as your criticism of the complexity of my Skill Limitation quirks has inspired me to streamline them. First, I realized that I could roll Technique Focus into the other variants; it still winds up as a net limitation. To balance this, I have removed the note about figured statistics (i.e., parry) for most versions. What do you think of it now?

Technique Focus (Skill Limitation Quirks)

That's the great thing about this kind of discussion ... it shakes things up a bit, so you can see what needs attention and re-think it from a different angle.

When looked at this way, they seem almost more like "Super Techniques," or bundles of techniques, which is how I'd probably use them ... I think it's good that they don't normally add to defenses, etc, but only to a handful of specific actions. I might be inclined to do them as 2/level rather than 3/level, or else enlarge the bundles a little.

I think my favorite implementation of them is as a way for a martial artist to get good at most or all of the techniques of a particular style.

Originally Posted by Gef

PPS: As you can see, I apply the "Unique Technique" perk even for techniques that do not violate the usual rules for creating new techniques, if instruction is limited to a particular style in the campaign world.

That's totally in the spirit of Unique Technique -- basically, an Unusual Background for a single technique, which others can't even attempt.

Originally Posted by Gef

Obviously we're designing styles for different fantasy worlds, but if my examples suggest we're on parallel tracks, PM me with a place to send the whole durn file. I think I'm a bit farther along this road. I'd ask two things: 1) realize it's a work in progress; the parts that aren't finished are fairly obvious. 2) For the ones you study enough to adapt, I'd appreciate feedback on what makes sense, especially if you have real experience in addition to the Martial Arts book to go on. -GEF

Sure, I'd love to see what you've got ... even I don't use any of the styles themselves, I'll grab the parts that I like, and that fit into one of the styles I'm working with.

I've actually got several more styles (in various stages of completion) on the campaign website, these are just the ones I'm currently cogitating over. I'll probably keep posting more here, one or two at a time, just to see what kind of feedback I get.

[Gef]

>Counterattack specifically only works after you successfully defend against an attack

Please indulge me in a moment of Duh.

>I might be inclined to do them as 2/level rather than 3/level, or else enlarge the bundles a little.

A single technique can cost 2 for the first level; these add to multiple techniques and to certain actions that can't normally take a bonus, such as All-Out Attack.

>That's totally in the spirit of Unique Technique -- basically, an Unusual Background for a single technique, which others can't even attempt.

If there's nothing rule-bending about it, I'd allow others to attempt it at default and even self-train, but not to find an instructor until they learn the style. I tend to be generous with how I let players spend earned experience, and in the case of martial art styles I would let them improve their techniques, rationalizing, "a lesson you had from your master suddenly makes more sense after what you just saw in a real fight." With a unique technique from another style, obviously there was no such lesson.

>I've actually got several more styles (in various stages of completion) on the campaign website

I'll take a look soonish.

GEF

[CousinX]

Zhentish Rapier Fencing
Befitting its place of origin, this style is deceptive and underhanded, relying on feints and surprise moves to seize and keep the advantage. The style is taught with a rapier and main-gauche, but can be used (with reduced effectiveness) with just a rapier. A fencer displaying only the rapier sometimes keeps his off hand tucked in the small of his back (but often carries a concealed knife there). Practitioners develop their own tricks and surprises as well, and the style has a solid foundation of technique that makes it formidable fighting art.

Skills: Main-Gauche, Rapier, Holdout.
Techniques: Bind Weapon, Feint.
Cinematic Techniques: Dual-Weapon Attack, Sinister Dagger.
Perks: Dirty Fighting, Off-Hand Training (Fast-Draw (Knife)), Off-Hand Weapon Training (Main-Gauche), Technique Mastery (Bind Weapon; Feint; Sinister Dagger), Two as One (Rapier and Main-Gauche), Unique Technique (Sinister Dagger).

Sinister Dagger (A) Holdout-6; cannot exceed Holdout.
Prerequisites: Weapon Master (Main-Gauche); Off-Hand Weapon Training (Main-Gauche).
If you haven't yet attacked or defended with a knife or main-gauche in your off hand (including one that was just Fast-Drawn), or your current foe is otherwise unaware of it, you can attempt to use it for a surprise attack. If you succeed a Sinister Dagger roll, your first attack with the knife is defended at -4. (This is instead of the normal bonus for a Hidden Weapon -- see DF2, p. 12.) This is part of a normal off-hand attack, and doesn’t require an extra action, Rapid Strike, etc – it can be made as part of a Dual-Weapon Attack, though the defense penalty applies only to the first sinister dagger strike. Such a trick only works once per opponent per fight, and anyone who's seen you do it before gets a +2 to resist the Ruse. It can benefit from Dirty Fighting, if used in appropriate circumstances for that perk to function.
You can also use your Sinister Dagger level in a normal Ruse (p. MA101), in place of IQ-based weapon skill. (Credit: Gold & Appel Inc.)

Perk - Two as One (Main-Gauche and Rapier): This perk merges the style's skills into a single body. Instead of improving two separate fencing skill, you always use the higher of your Rapier or Main-Gauche skills when wielding the two together. Any technique, perk, or other ability (including Enhanced Parry, Weapon Master, Imbuement skills, etc) that you have which applies to either skill, but could also be bought for the other, need only be purchased once to apply to both skills. This only applies when wielding the two weapons together; you still use the normal skill when wielding one or the other by itself. Requires the Off-Hand Weapon Training (Main-Gauche) style perk; you must also have at least one point in both Rapier and Main-Gauche skills.

[CousinX]

Way of the Broken Order
The legendary “pain-bearers” of the Broken Order are pious mendicant monks who have forsaken their worldly status and possessions (apart from the simple belongings they carry with them), wandering the land to aid the suffering and preach the word of the Holy Church. At once sacred mystics and master martial artists, they spread the influence of Ilmater by easing suffering and protecting the weak from the depredations of the ruthless.

Ilmatari Monks enter the monastery at a young age, taking an austere life of prayer, and training to endure incredible physical hardships as means of enhancing their connection with Martyred God. The legendary training program is said to have been influenced by a wondering Shou monk who took shelter at an Ilmateri monastery, and was so impressed by their piety and endurance that he taught them his own ways. This style is unknown outside the Order, and thus not available as a power-up unless purchased along with the Monk of the Broken Order lens (and a suitable martial artist lens, for those who lack Trained by a Master and/or the required style skills).

Skills: Judo, Karate, Meditation, Theology. (Optional: Jitte/Sai, Tonfa, Staff.)
Cinematic Skills: Autohypnosis, Pressure Points, Pressure Secrets.
Cinematic Techniques: Hand-Clap Parry, Pressure-Point Strike, Roll With Blow.
Perks: Deft Touch, Patience of Job, Power Grappling.

Martial Artist Lens: Monk of the Broken Order (50 points)
Attributes: +1 IQ (20).
Advantages: High Pain Threshold (10); Higher Purpose 1 (Protect the helpless and downtrodden) (5); Holiness 1 (Ilmater) (5); and Style Familiarity (Way of the Broken Order) (1).
Disadvantages: Vow (Own no more than can be carried) (-10); replace Disciplines of Faith (Chi Rituals) (-10) with Disciplines of Faith (Ilmatari Mendicant) (-15), for an additional -5 points.
Skills: Esoteric Medicine (H) Per (4)-11; Panhandling (E) IQ (1)-11; Theology (H) IQ (4)-11. • Jitte/Sai, Staff, and Tonfa are the most common weapon skills, although many monks will opt for purely unarmed combat; cutting and stabbing weapons are rare.
Special Abilities: 15 points chosen from among Ilmater’s Holy abilities, and the Style Perks (1/perk) and Power-Ups (Varies) of the Way of the Broken Order. (Optionally, points in the martial artist template that are designated for Chi abilities, optional advantages, or special skills may be spent on these traits instead).
Power-ups: For the purpose of power-ups, Monks of the Broken Order are martial artists with the holy warrior lens. They can always buy the Style Perks and Power-Ups for the Way of the Broken Order, as well as Holiness up to 6 (5/level), and the Holy abilities of Ilmater. Some become full clerics by adding the Holy Warrior-Cleric lens (DF3, p. 26), though they get only 15 points (as opposed to 20) for additional Holy abilities and/or cleric spells, owing to the fact that they start with Holiness 1 rather than 2.

Disciplines of Faith (Ilmatari Mendicant)
A monk of the Broken Order must renounce all worldly possessions beyond that which he carries with him, wandering the land as a mendicant healer, preacher, and protector of the weak. He must own only that which he needs to survive – which may include high-quality or magical gear, but never anything ostentatious or superfluous. He must spend at least 1d hours each day in contemplation and practice, as for Chi Rituals, but he doesn’t spend extra on rations. Instead, he must give 20% of his share of any material rewards (loot, payments, rewards, etc) to charity (e.g. the Church, a hospital, or spent directly to aid the poor). He may choose to give more – and Ilmater won’t fail to notice such pious generosity – but may not come to special arrangements with party members to get around the tithe (e.g. take only half a share of loot, and have an ally buy equipment for him, etc). His Chi and Holy abilities are contingent on maintaining these disciplines, as well as on upholding his vows and tenets of faith.

Special Power-Ups:

Armor of Piety (10 points)
Prerequisites: Monk of the Broken Order; Holiness 4+; Meditation at Will; Theology at IQ.
Giving up physical armor in favor of divine protection, the monk develops a powerful shield of faith. Wearing any armor beyond simple clothing (but not including items such as Ironskin amulets or Bracers of Force) suspends all of the character’s Chi and Holy abilities, as though he’d failed to do his rituals and burned the power out, until he spends a day in prayer and penance.
Advantages: DR 4 (Can’t Wear Armor, -40%; Force Field, +20%; Holy, -10%) (14); Luck (Defensive, -20%; Holy, -10%) (11)
Disadvantages: Vow (Never wear armor) (-15).

Master of the Empty Hand (10 points)
Prerequisites: Monk of the Broken Order; Holiness 4+; both Judo and Karate at DX+1.
By forswearing the use of any kind of weapon beyond his own body, a monk can gain special blessings in unarmed combat. Any use of a weapon in combat suspends all of the character’s Chi and Holy abilities, as though he’d failed to do his rituals and burned the power out, until he spends a day in prayer and penance.
Advantages: DR 2 (Hands and feet only, -20%; Holy, -10%; Tough Skin, -40%) (3); Lifting ST 6 (Grappling only, -60%; Holy, -10%) (6); Striker (Crushing; Holy, -10%; Fists, -20%) (4); Striking ST 6 (Holy, -10%; Unarmed only, -60%) (9).
Perks: Iron Arms, Legs, and Neck (3).
Disadvantages: Vow (Always fight unarmed) (-15).

Perk - Deft Touch: This perk has two forms – Pressure Points and Pressure Secrets; each must be purchased separately. For the chosen skill, use DX instead of IQ. Requires Trained by a Master.

[Gef]

>the style has a solid foundation of technique

Bind and Feint?

>Sinister Dagger
>...roll a Quick Contest of your Holdout+4 against your opponent's Per
>...anyone who's seen you do it before gets a +2 to resist

Seems far too effective to me. I'm okay with the once-per-fight free Feint, but your giving a huge bonus as well, so much so that it swamps the resistance even of someone who expects the move! At the very least, allow resistance with the defender's highest Feint. In fact, I'd say this technique counts as a Ruse (p. MA101) and so takes Feint technique.

>Two as One (Main-Gauche and Rapier)

Sounds like Weapon Adaptation. Any fencing weapon meets the requirements for Weapon Adaptation to a different fencing skill. If it really is a two-weapon style, I'd make Weapon Adaptation (use a rapier with Main-Gauche skill) a Signature Perk. That way, you can use rapier and main-gauche together from the start, although you can't attack effectively with the off-hand, you still get an unpenalized parry. That's why it's rapier with MG skill instead of vice versa.

[Gold & Appel Inc]

Originally Posted by Gef

>the style has a solid foundation of technique

Bind and Feint?

That's small-t technique; they learn real weapon skills, not just dirty tricks.

Originally Posted by CousinX

Sinister Dagger (H) Holdout; cannot exceed Holdout+4.
Prerequisites: Weapon Master (Main-Gauche); Off-Hand Weapon Training (Main-Gauche).
If you haven't yet attacked or defended with a small blade (see Hidden Weapons, DF2, p. 12) in your off hand – including one that was just Fast-Drawn – or your current foe is otherwise unaware of it, roll a Quick Contest of your Holdout+4 against your opponent's Per, and treat as a Feint – if you win, subtract your margin of success or victory from the opponent's defense against an attack from the knife. (This is instead of the normal bonus for Hidden Weapons.) This is part of the normal off-hand attack, and doesn’t require an extra action, Rapid Strike, etc – it can be made as part of a Dual-Weapon Attack, though the feint bonus doesn’t apply to any attack other than the first sinister dagger strike. Such a trick only works once per opponent per fight, and anyone who's seen you do it before gets a +2 to resist the Feint. It can benefit from Dirty Fighting, if used in appropriate circumstances for that perk to function.

I like this idea a lot, but the execution bugs me a little... We don't see anything in the technique design RAW for stacking a Feint and Attack into one (non-AoA/Committed) Attack at any price. Even rolling a Feint into a Committed Attack is a little bonus; they should technically all be AoAs. Also, the base technique from DF has a -2 to do this with a large knife, so if you're assuming a Main-Gauche for all uses in this style you should probably roll that into the default penalty (so it can be bought off, on the one hand, but then the max is Skill, not Skill+4, without Technique Mastery) (which I would totally add to the style perks). I'd probably just keep it as-written in DF2, but as an Average technique (it's just a weapon strike, after all) with a jazzed-up bonus for a total default of Holdout -6 (-2 for Main-Gauche size, -8 for -4 instead of -2 to all opponent's Defenses, +1 for the extra set-up roll which the attack fails without, +1 for restricted weapon choice, +1 for limited circumstances: once-per-fight, and +1 for limited circumstances: target is unaware of weapon) and max of Holdout unless I wanted to build it as an AoA/Committed-only like Spinning Strike (which would preserve the quick contest and higher potential defense penalty, but probably offer less of a net bonus on average to all but the most advanced users).

I'd also let it sub in for your Ruse Feint level if you devote a full action to making one under the proper conditions, including a Ruse that benefits the Rapier hand or another attack if you reveal the hidden Main-Gauche during the Feint.

[CousinX]

Originally Posted by Gef

>the style has a solid foundation of technique

Bind and Feint?

Originally Posted by Gold & Appel Inc

That's small-t technique; they learn real weapon skills, not just dirty tricks.

Exactly ... "body of technique" in the flavor-text sense. :)

Originally Posted by Gef

>Sinister Dagger

Seems far too effective to me.
[...]
In fact, I'd say this technique counts as a Ruse (p. MA101) and so takes Feint technique.

Originally Posted by Gold & Appel Inc

[...]
I'd probably just keep it as-written in DF2, but as an Average technique (it's just a weapon strike, after all) with a jazzed-up bonus for a total default of Holdout -6 (-2 for Main-Gauche size, -8 for -4 instead of -2 to all opponent's Defenses, +1 for the extra set-up roll which the attack fails without, +1 for restricted weapon choice, +1 for limited circumstances: once-per-fight, and +1 for limited circumstances: target is unaware of weapon) and max of Holdout unless I wanted to build it as an AoA/Committed-only like Spinning Strike (which would preserve the quick contest and higher potential defense penalty, but probably offer less of a net bonus on average to all but the most advanced users).

Hmmm.... yeah, I like that.

Originally Posted by Gold & Appel Inc

I'd also let it sub in for your Ruse Feint level if you devote a full action to making one under the proper conditions, including a Ruse that benefits the Rapier hand or another attack if you reveal the hidden Main-Gauche during the Feint.

Seems fair.

Okay, rewrite forthcoming.

.....And, done. Thanks for the help!

Originally Posted by Gef

>Two as One (Main-Gauche and Rapier)

Sounds like Weapon Adaptation. Any fencing weapon meets the requirements for Weapon Adaptation to a different fencing skill. If it really is a two-weapon style, I'd make Weapon Adaptation (use a rapier with Main-Gauche skill) a Signature Perk. That way, you can use rapier and main-gauche together from the start, although you can't attack effectively with the off-hand, you still get an unpenalized parry. That's why it's rapier with MG skill instead of vice versa.

The Signature Perk is another house rule that I'm still on the fence about ... I like Weapon Adaptation better than the original Two as One perk I was using (for this style as well as for Hand-and-a-Half), and so that's basically what Two in One is now -- renamed Weapon Adaptation -- but it seems arbitrarily closer to RAW to treat it as a Style Perk, and to require at least one point in each skill that's being folded together.