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Old 07-03-2012, 07:18 AM   #11
Wildcat
 
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Default Re: "A Song of Ice and Fire" characters

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Originally Posted by borithan View Post
I am wondering if Gregor really should be ST 24. I am fairly sure the descriptions of the dual for Tyrion's life heavily suggests that that he has to ready it again when he makes an attack.
I guess I haven't gotten that far in reading the books. I'm about 2/3 of the way through A Clash of Kings. With that in mind, I'll drop it to 22, because he is still definitely stronger than is realistically possible for a "normal" human.

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Originally Posted by DocRailgun View Post
The Cleganes may be landed knights but their family is looked down upon (if feared) by the established noble families. The Cleganes are little better than hedge knights... after all, the grandfather of the Mountain and the Hound was a kennel-keeper for the Lannisters.
The Starks have been nobles for 8000 years. 40 or so for the Cleganes is nothing. So, if they have a high Status it's because that's what the Lannisters want, rather... what Tywin wants. If Jaime or Tyrion were Lord Lannister the Cleganes would be out on their over-large ears... though I admit that is just conjecture.
So, I think Gregor also should have some sort of fairly-harsh negative social reputation.
I added a negative reputation among nobles, but I kept it to -1. I think he's looked down on more harshly for the killing of Rhaegar's family, "disappearances" in his lands, and execution of a soldier for snoring too loudly than for being from a family with ignoble roots.

Last edited by Wildcat; 07-03-2012 at 07:26 AM.
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Old 07-03-2012, 07:49 AM   #12
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Default Re: "A Song of Ice and Fire" characters

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
Your grasp of basics appears sound. I'd worsen all his disads by one level though. He appears to have serious anger management issues indeed.
Eh, I think the original SCs are fine when he's sober. The problem is that Gregor, like Andre the Giant, drinks a whole lot to manage the physical and emotional pain his condition causes him.

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
I mght lower his secondary weapon skuills by a point too. I'm sure he's terrifying. I'm not sure he's actually that skilled.
"You think Ser Gregor's lance rode up by accident, do you? [snip] Gregor's lance goes where Gregor wants it to go." -The Hound.

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Originally Posted by Wildcat View Post
But when Tywin doesn't unleash him, Ser Gregor needs a way to support his Status 3 (although his cost is only for Status 2 because of his Military Rank). And I don't imagine a landed knight like him having a "job" aside from war, unless he is able to live off ransoming horses and armor to the knights he defeats in jousts.
Yeah, Gregor very probably murdered his parents for their land, which he is now the sole lord over. Average Wealth with enough IA to pay for his plus-size standard kit when he isn't off having fun at his paid hobby raping and pillaging for Tywin in times of open war is 100% reasonable.

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I'd take Bloodlust all the way down to 6 or less; This is a man who murders helpless children.
Yeah, when he thinks it would give him big ups with the boss. Many of the people that we see him brutalize are left alive.

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I might consider dropping IQ and buying up some form of military talent, he's good at killing stuff, but that's all he's good at.
Killing stuff is what he enjoys. We don't have any evidence that he's below-average IQ besides stereotypes about huge people - He engages in normal dialogue with other characters the few times we see him talk at all, and has apparently committed a large number of stealthy murders without leaving enough proof to inconvenience him beyond his reputation. IQ 10 is fair, IMHO.

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I also think he should have Patron - the entire saga is basically about this interwoven thread of Patronage and Duty and nearly everyone (noble or not) will have some level of both.
Duty, yes, but Tywin throws him right under the bus the second it's more convenient than keeping him around.
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Old 07-03-2012, 08:00 AM   #13
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Default Re: "A Song of Ice and Fire" characters

Damn it, why does this have to be so complicated? I thought I picked out a really straightforward character -- at least as far as GRRM's characters go -- to design. He's a combat monster who is about as awful of a person as there is in the Seven Kingdoms. How can I stat the more complex characters like Tyrion, Littlefinger, or Jamie if I can't succeed with The Mountain?

Maybe I should have started with Hodor. Or Ned at the end of the first book.

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Old 07-03-2012, 08:00 AM   #14
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Default Re: "A Song of Ice and Fire" characters

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The Starks have been nobles for 8000 years.
The Starks are the line of the kings of one of the Seven Kingdoms; they aren't all that typical of nobles either. I'd say Ser Gregor out to be, status-wise, at the level expected for a landed knight, since he is a landed knight. (Reaction-wise, he won't do as well as that suggests, but that's more a matter of Reputation, side effects of mental disads, and maybe an OPH or two.)
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Old 07-03-2012, 08:04 AM   #15
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Damn it, why does this have to be so complicated?
Because you posted it to a thread in a forum on the internet. ;]

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I thought I picked out a really straightforward character -- at least as far as GRRM's characters go -- to design. He's a combat monster who is about as awful of a person as there is in the Seven Kingdoms.
You ain't lyin'.

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How can I stat the more complex characters like Tyrion, Littlefinger, or Jamie if I can't succeed with The Mountain?
Do you feel the need to succeed flawlessly on the first draft? If not, you have your answer.

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Fixed for you. ;]
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Old 07-03-2012, 08:34 AM   #16
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Old 07-03-2012, 08:34 AM   #17
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Default Re: "A Song of Ice and Fire" characters

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"You think Ser Gregor's lance rode up by accident, do you? [snip] Gregor's lance goes where Gregor wants it to go." -The Hound.
Exactly the quote I was thinking of in response to the same comment. Those who think the Mountain is merely a clumsy brute are due for a fatal surprise.

That said, the Hound outfights him. Something to be considered in statting out the Hound. (Which reminds me: perhaps give the Mountian an Enemy (Hound)?)
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Old 07-03-2012, 08:41 AM   #18
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Default Re: "A Song of Ice and Fire" characters

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Exactly the quote I was thinking of in response to the same comment. Those who think the Mountain is merely a clumsy brute are due for a fatal surprise.

That said, the Hound outfights him. Something to be considered in statting out the Hound. (Which reminds me: perhaps give the Mountian an Enemy (Hound)?)
I'd thought of statting Sandor out as my next one, actually. But I don't think he would technically be an Enemy for Gregor. He loathes Gregor with every fiber of his being, but he doesn't go out of his way to cause him harm.

I think I'm going to rebuild The Mountain from the ground up, then see about The Hound.
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Old 07-03-2012, 08:52 AM   #19
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"You think Ser Gregor's lance rode up by accident, do you? [snip] Gregor's lance goes where Gregor wants it to go." -The Hound.

I was just going to leave room for people who can beat Gregor in a joust. The lowered threshold for Bad Temper folows directly afterward.
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Old 07-03-2012, 10:20 AM   #20
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I'd thought of statting Sandor out as my next one, actually. But I don't think he would technically be an Enemy for Gregor. He loathes Gregor with every fiber of his being, but he doesn't go out of his way to cause him harm.
IMHO, Sandor is an Enemy (Rival) for Gregor. He really, really hates the guy, and would probably like to see him die horribly, and would surely like to insult him and show him up at every opportunity, but given the opportunity in the Hand's Tourney when Gregor went apes#!% on an innocent man with no helmet on, it is specifically noted that Sandor did not once attempt a strike to Gregor's head. It may be for social reasons, or it may be possible that Sandor, who (in a rare act of piety, or lack therof) named his horse Stranger, may actually fear the Seven enough to actively avoid kinslaying (or both).

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I was just going to leave room for people who can beat Gregor in a joust. The lowered threshold for Bad Temper folows directly afterward.
Ser Gregor doesn't blow a Bad Temper check in that scene until Ser Loras cheats. Ser Hugh is a calculated murder with the goal of his silence.
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